Should Robert Pattinson's Batman be part of James Gunn's DCU, or should it stay in the Reeves verse by itself? We're gonna debate that today on an all-new episode of Unbinged starting. Today, we have split ourselves up into two teams. We've got
Matthew Kopfhamer:I don't even know what's called
Alfredo Brown:team a. Sure. Why not? Team a, me, and Koff are going to be fighting for the Batman to be part of James Gunn's DCU. And then we've got team b, gross, nasty, stinky, probably smells really terrible.
Alfredo Brown:Jag and Sam, who are going to make the argument that this Batman should just stay in the Reeves verse.
Jagger May:That's wild.
Alfredo Brown:And to moderate all of it Lame. It should say it's wild.
Jagger May:I was like, what? So out of pocket.
Alfredo Brown:Is No bias whatsoever. I'm not the moderator.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Personal attacks only. Fair. Alright.
Alfredo Brown:I'm not the moderator. I don't have I don't have to behave well. But we do have a moderator that's gonna be leading this whole thing today. And Vig, Vig Nesteroswami has decided to be our moderator today. So, Vig, I'm gonna throw it to you, man.
Alfredo Brown:You're essentially hosting today's show. Good luck because we are not going to behave well.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Doctor Vignesh.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Yeah. Show him respect, Alfred.
Jagger May:Yeah. Call you doctor for this.
Alfredo Brown:He missed
Jagger May:all me.
Alfredo Brown:He didn't go to five years of evil medical school to be called mister.
Matthew Kopfhamer:But yeah. But this is this is gonna be a great episode because it's a lot of fun. Right? There's a lot of debate online. You know, we see sort of Matt Reeves and James Gunn even kind of getting in on the debate a little bit themselves on social media, but I think we are all team Reeves here.
Matthew Kopfhamer:We all love the Reeves, Robert Pattinson, Bativerse, whatever you wanna call it. The question is, does that great universe belong in DCU? And I can't wait to see what y'all have. I have a bunch of core criteria that I'm gonna be using to judge this. I'm not telling you what they are.
Matthew Kopfhamer:They might be completely wrong. I'll tell you at the very end what my criteria were, and people feel free to rip me to shreds if you don't like it. But I really just want you to make a strong case for the fans. What will benefit the fans the most? Keeping them separate or keeping them together?
Matthew Kopfhamer:So we got what? Team integrate and team separate? So, yeah, just, know
Jagger May:I don't like that. Give me your best. I don't
Alfredo Brown:like it. I like it. It was all I don't know. Jack.
Jagger May:Comfortable I
Matthew Kopfhamer:am with those terms.
Alfredo Brown:Jack not being on team integration is nuts.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Why? Oh, that's yeah.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Yeah. I did not yeah. I didn't think that far.
Jagger May:I really didn't think Batman.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Say it
Samantha Holt:in your
Jagger May:head first.
Samantha Holt:Say it
Jagger May:in your head
Samantha Holt:first before you say it out loud.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Which team is offering 40 acres and a mule?
Jagger May:We get the Jim Crow Batman.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Jesus. Alright. Big, get us an order, man. Get us a line.
Samantha Holt:Which one of us gets to go first and tell why the other one's wrong?
Matthew Kopfhamer:You know, honestly, because Alfredo started off being so mean so mean, I'm gonna make his team go first so that Jagged Sam get a shot at rebuttal. So they get a shot at rebuttal. No rebuttal for you at first, Alfredo.
Matthew Kopfhamer:They're like butts, I bet.
Jagger May:No one interrupts. Abide by the rules.
Alfredo Brown:Do less, cough. Yes.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Alright. Yeah. Proper debates, guys. No interruptions. Write down your points.
Matthew Kopfhamer:If you have counterarguments, give it later, but let people let them give you their their argument, their best story. Sorry. I don't know. Matt, Alfredo, which one of y'all are going first, but have at it.
Alfredo Brown:Alfredo. Are are we giving our opening statements, or is there is there a question to be had here, moderator?
Matthew Kopfhamer:No question, man. Like I said, you get your opening statement. This is a regular debate. I'm not gonna ask an opening question. We have our big overarching question.
Matthew Kopfhamer:That's one we're gonna use. Do do they belong together, or do they belong separate? I don't know. Is it separate but equal? You let me know.
Alfredo Brown:Alright. Absolutely. I would love to take the floor here. Moderator, as you mentioned, this is all about the fans. It's not about these corporate bigwigs sitting behind their desks making their money.
Alfredo Brown:This is about the fans. And what do the fans want? Simply said, they want quality. In the past, we have seen that quality can get muddied up by giving so many different variations of a character and then having to trust more and more filmmakers down the line. We know that we have a great version of this Batman that can work in cohesion with this new DCU.
Alfredo Brown:Matt Reeves, James Gunn, both are willing to work together, both have talked to each other, and both already work together under the DC studios guys. Now these two men can't create a great Batman for a DCU. I yield my time. I love the Obama
Matthew Kopfhamer:That was a good short short good short argument. Yeah. A good delivery, good cadence. You know, all you get all the style points, Alfredo, but you just said you don't want, too many cooks to spoil the brat. So you took two cooks and put them together in the same brat.
Matthew Kopfhamer:So alright. Kafa, I think you get your opening statement now, and then we'll let the other two give theirs.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Sure. A lot of my points are gonna coincide with Alfredo. I think he hit the
Matthew Kopfhamer:base So no creativity. Okay. Got it.
Matthew Kopfhamer:You got it. I am white.
Alfredo Brown:Moderator. Sub decorum. Moderator, please.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Anyhoo, so quality first and foremost. And we have two filmmakers that we've now seen, one elevated to the studio head in James Gunn that can take take IPs and produce quality stories. And while I can understand from our, you know, super fan perspective why separating those universes would make sense, I think in the broader sense of the term, it doesn't because you have the casual fan and the casual audience that are gonna get confused when you have two or more versions of the same character running around on screen. It might work when there's separation between television and movies, but I don't think it's gonna work in the greater sense of the of the idea when you have multiple movies with multiple iterations of the same character. I think, like Alfredo said, that muddies the water, and it makes it harder to be successful down the down the road.
Matthew Kopfhamer:So I think keeping them in the same universe just creates the cohesion that we as audiences want as long as the quality is there. So you bring it together, you make it work, you have the grittiness of Batman, you have the hopefulness of Superman, and that's really the core of what makes a team up movie like the Justice League in the future hopefully work.
Alfredo Brown:Moderate audience, Justice League.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Yes. Yeah. Yeah, man. This is still your man's time. I'll yeah.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Well, technically, no, you don't. But you know what? I'll give it. I'll allow it because
Jagger May:I'll remember that.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Because we're doing we're doing fake debate rules. Little man rules.
Alfredo Brown:This this is just one final statement. One final statement that is now more relevant than ever, and that is that a house divided cannot stand, and a character divided cannot succeed.
Matthew Kopfhamer:You just thought that sounded good.
Jagger May:Yeah. Cool. Of course,
Alfredo Brown:it sounded good. I'm going for the style points. Damn it. Hit us up in the comments. I was read
Jagger May:all the quotes on Monday now. I was like, Sam, open up with the god we trust. The blurb is literally
Samantha Holt:In Batman, we trust.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Alfredo's got too many cooks will spoil the brat, but we're gonna put two great cooks together anyway. Cough Scott
Jagger May:Hey.
Matthew Kopfhamer:It works in the bear.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Some great points.
Alfredo Brown:Sir, sir, there's going to be there's gonna be multiple cooks regardless. Oh, gosh. Okay. Fans are
Matthew Kopfhamer:too stupid. Right? That's what Cough Scott. The fans are too stupid to appreciate two separate things. They can't the fans can't take
Matthew Kopfhamer:General audiences. General audiences, Vignesh. I'm feeling a lot of hostility from this moderator. I I want a new one.
Jagger May:I feel good, Sam. Feeling really good. No. You know?
Alfredo Brown:There's no unbiased decorum from the moderator right now, and it's really upsetting.
Jagger May:Sucks, dude. Should've been red. You
Matthew Kopfhamer:should've should've thought carefully before before letting me my Man, sucks, tell me. But, no, some good points too. And, you know, I think some things Koff talked about that I really like too is, you know, the the potential for a future better Justice League or maybe I really did like the point about the positivity and hope of Superman, which is what we really love about Superman and maybe the grittiness of Batman. So two different visual tones. We'll see how they work together.
Matthew Kopfhamer:I'm not sure. But, okay, some good points. Well taken. But Jagger, Sam, do y'all have an idea? Which one of y'all is gonna go first to give you give us your opening statements and maybe refute some of these points that team blue, if y'all notice our our team keep them together group is blue or keep them separate group is red, and I got purple in my background.
Matthew Kopfhamer:We thought about that visual thematics.
Jagger May:That's better than segregation. I'm not sure. Sam, I'll let you go for that.
Alfredo Brown:Jack being team red and separate is nuts.
Jagger May:Do you just wanna, like should should I be, like, in a Sith robe right now? What's next? Sith robe with a little Nazi sash? Sam, I'll let you start.
Samantha Holt:My argument to keep these worlds apart. And I think it's with love, I wanna keep them apart. It's not because of hate. It's because I love Batman so much, and I also love Superman so much. I want to keep them separate to keep them both good at its core.
Samantha Holt:I've loved Batman since forever. I think one of the first pictures that my mom showed me when I was a kid was me running around wearing a Batman t shirt. And I only wanted to ever wear my Batman t shirt. It was that or Little Mermaid, and that's my entire personality, and that's how you need to know me. So I'm obsessed, and I need Batman to stay on his own because especially in these new worlds that we've been creating, we've got we've got the Matt Reeves Batman.
Samantha Holt:We also have the Christopher Nolan Batman that I'm gonna be drawing comparisons to why they don't need to be in with Superman. There's a grittiness to this Batman that would be spoiled and sullied by adding this world of magic and elemental elements with aliens and all of these things that would spoil Batman completely, in my opinion. And I think that we need to keep them separate for that reason. You've got this dark underworld where you're dealing with mob bosses and all of these really, really rich elements that don't need the added level of magic and superpowers and fantasy that you're gonna get with Superman as well as Justice League and all these other things. I also feel like you have plenty of characters that would make Justice League more successful without bringing in Batman.
Samantha Holt:You don't necessarily need him. I would say keep him separate. If they wanna cast another guy to be Batman, fine. But you're gonna have just as much success with that as you did with Ben Affleck jumping in as Batman right after you had Christian Bale. And I don't wanna see my Batman get distorted in that way.
Samantha Holt:Did I jump around too much, Jag?
Jagger May:Or No. Can't. I'm not
Matthew Kopfhamer:that right now. Same with the not my Batman from the top row. No. I Not my Batman.
Jagger May:Sam, you you have, like, the perfect setup for where I wanna go because to both give a rebuttal, particularly to what Kaa's big point was and add to what you said, I'm gonna use Spider Man as an example. Because when I consider the both spectrums of both DC and Marvel, I consider Marvel, Spider Man on the Marvel side and Batman on the DC side to be parallel. Not in the not in the sense that they're the same type of hero, but these are two central characters that have such a rich stable of villains and a rich universe all on their own. More importantly, we have, like, five different Spider Men, and I think the audience has only benefited because we get more Spider Man, and they're smart enough to be able to discern the difference. I'm not watching Beyond the Spider Verse and saying, which one's the Spider Verse?
Jagger May:You know? I'm not you know, like, where is Zendaya? I'm not asking that question when I watch
Alfredo Brown:Your honor, he stole my joke. I would like that to be stricken from the record.
Jagger May:Your honor, it's called I've taken someone else's point. Against them. But with that being said, I think that if we get more Batman, all we're doing is we're allowing room to get two stories and two different sides of Batman without either of them sullying the other. You know? Like, sometimes when you get fusion food, all you do is just you get a shittier version of both.
Jagger May:Whereas, like, someone like Sam, I don't know how much you've read Batman or not. There Batman is so much bigger than beyond the comics that we have dedicated fans beyond just comic books. I want you to see stories that we don't have room for when we're worried about the bigger DC universe, where I wanna just get deeper into the quarter valves. I wanna know what's going on with Gotham. I wanna know what's going on with all the players here.
Jagger May:And when you have it in a larger universe, I don't get to explore that.
Samantha Holt:Agreed. Completely.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Alright. So, Jagger, with some really great points about the reasons why they should stay separate. What do y'all think? Have y'all had some time to formulate your first rebuttal? Koff, Ameren, Alfredo.
Matthew Kopfhamer:I have questions, and I'll get to those questions. But right now, just gonna leave it a little bit more open. Allow you to, like, fight the fight the good fight.
Alfredo Brown:Absolutely. I get it off. Can I can I have a Go for it?
Matthew Kopfhamer:Yeah. You can go first. You should wanna go first?
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. Yes, please. Yes, please. Thank you. Look at that.
Matthew Kopfhamer:That's that's scoffing
Alfredo Brown:a gentleman right there. Adorable. Okay. Adorable. Well, first and foremost, I'd like to rebuttal here.
Alfredo Brown:Sam's discussion about how this Batman could be sullied by the fantastical. You don't have Batman without the fantastical. You don't have it without villains that have powers. You don't have Batman without the rest of the Justice League. You don't have that throughout the story.
Alfredo Brown:He's full Batman. You you you don't. You end up with a sort of watered down version of Batman like Christopher Nolan gave us, and I love those movies and respect those movies. But the driving force behind that character was finding a means to an end so that he could be with the woman he loves. That is when you alter Batman is when you remove these things from him, and you give us a watered down version of Batman.
Alfredo Brown:Furthermore, we talk about how Ben Affleck coming in after Christian Bale muddies up the waters continuously. So do we now need a fourth Batman in a short amount of time right here after Pattinson to continue to muddy up those waters? And lastly, the Spider Man example. We've had many Spider Man. That has led to many movies not being good.
Alfredo Brown:Two. That's
Jagger May:Two. Sorry. Sorry, judge.
Alfredo Brown:That's that's the court of public opinion there, but we'll leave that open. However however and I'll say this. Yes. We did end up with something cool where we got all three Spider Men in one movie. We already tried that with Batman where we had George Clooney, Michael Keaton, and Ben Affleck all in one film directed by Andy Muschetti, the man slated to direct Batman, the brave and the bold.
Alfredo Brown:He got his opportunity to have multiple Batman in one film. We cannot let this Batman become what Sony did to Spider Man and create this whole Spider Man verse without Spider Man in it. This Batman needs to be protected. This Batman needs the fantastical. This Batman needs to be part of the DCU.
Jagger May:I actually did not know that all three Batman weren't that Flash movie. I don't intentionally watch bad
Matthew Kopfhamer:movies. It's awful.
Alfredo Brown:You gotta you gotta watch more shitty movies, bro.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Yeah, dude. It's I'm good. I know that hurts for Alfredo. So Alfredo loves the Christopher Nolan movies, and for him to criticize that in any way shows shows you how seriously he's taking this debate. Yeah, you know, that that is one of the bigger things we were trying to see is, did did the Christopher Nolan movies it's an entire different topic entirely together.
Matthew Kopfhamer:But did they really suffer because Batman didn't get to do and deal with the magic and the fantasy and all of that nonsense?
Alfredo Brown:I don't know.
Samantha Holt:Didn't need
Matthew Kopfhamer:There's there's a I didn't I didn't even finish my question. They're already saying we didn't need it. Sorry.
Jagger May:Like, will see, like, his
Samantha Holt:points billionaire.
Jagger May:Yeah. His points about the he had valid criticisms, but those criticisms don't prove the point that it would be bad to have two separate Batman for that particular point. If anything, it just proves that, wow. Christopher Nolan had flaws, and that was still a nine out of 10 movie. So you're telling me that if we try even harder, we can get a 10 out
Matthew Kopfhamer:10? Difference is those were always intended to be separate, and there was no greater plan for a expanded DC universe beyond that. Whereas this is different because there is a plan to have a greater expanded DC. And how are you going to keep your two pillars, two out of the four pillars of the DC separate in separate universes? That's gonna again, I keep going back to general audiences.
Matthew Kopfhamer:They are in the they are in the news every day like we are where we're like, oh, what did Matt Reeves say? What did James Gunn say? Like, they don't give a shit. They're going they're like, oh, a new Batman movie's coming out. Let's go watch it.
Matthew Kopfhamer:And then if you're gonna tell me that excuse me. If a Batman movie and a Superman movie come out in the same year and they are two separate stories, they're not gonna confuse the general audience. And that's gonna muddy this the discussion of, are they good movies? Whereas if you have a cohesive line through where you you can have separate stories. We've seen this in Marvel where they can have separate stories that are good.
Matthew Kopfhamer:I give you the Iron Man trilogy. I give you the the original Captain America trilogy, where those are two separate stories that they can still come together in an Avengers team up, and it makes sense. It's cohesive. It works. So you can't tell me that James Gunn can't do the same thing with Batman and Superman, one of which is a played by Robert Pattinson, who's already proved he can play a good Batman.
Matthew Kopfhamer:He can be a good Batman in a story that is set up, that can work in opposition or in tonally opposition to what Superman represents. And you can't tell me that's not gonna that wouldn't succeed.
Jagger May:Sam, you wanna fire a few shots before I toss a grenade?
Samantha Holt:I'll I'll just do some softball ones if you've got a grenade going. But my my thing with Batman is he's a billionaire. He doesn't need this fantastical level. If we're talking about that specifically, you you bring up Iron Man and bring up Thor. Okay.
Samantha Holt:You've got a God of Thunder that's thrown onto Earth. Yes, he has powers. And then you've got Iron Man who's a millionaire that creates a suit that gives him powers. What's amazing and unique about Batman is he's a billionaire that has all the money and he's using these fun gadgets, but it's the grittiness of him, his story that wants to keep Gotham from falling into darkness. And it's this vengeance trying to restore what is good in the city.
Samantha Holt:So it's this city story that kind of also keeps Gotham and Batman away from everyone else. Because if you also have this DC universe where you've got, you know, you've got the Flash and you've got Superman, Why are they not all jumping into Gotham to helps to help? Because it clearly is in desperate need of saving. And it is the forgotten city that no one wants to save, and that's why Batman's taken it on to save it. I'm gonna make everybody mad, it's fine.
Alfredo Brown:But slippery slope. Where where's Thor to defend New York?
Jagger May:That's that's saying that's actually thank you.
Matthew Kopfhamer:It is.
Samantha Holt:It's valid.
Jagger May:Sam, you're like a great point guard right here because that's all I was gonna say. Kosta Ark of your point about the Iron Man movies and the Captain America movies, the Iron Man trilogy is arguably the worst within within DC. It is the
Matthew Kopfhamer:afterward. Yeah. Because it's a Marvel movie.
Alfredo Brown:Which is which is a perfect point to illustrate why why the movies should not stand on their own. Because what happens when you try to keep this character contained on its own, you're going to run out of story. What made Tony Stark and Robert Downey junior's Iron Man that much better and enriched his character was putting him with the Avengers, giving us civil war, giving us more.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Go for it.
Samantha Holt:You had a grenade to me. Yeah. Was about to say.
Alfredo Brown:It it's counterpoint. But he pulled that pin, and it blew
Jagger May:up in
Alfredo Brown:his hand.
Jagger May:It's counteract you've made made you've made codependent. Will. Characters. The reason why Iron Man didn't work as well is because it didn't drive the plot of the Avengers four. It felt like a distraction, and we could talk about Shane Black being a shitty director.
Jagger May:That's a whole other fucking thing. But that is the main point. What made Captain America
Matthew Kopfhamer:the point of those Iron Man movies.
Jagger May:I'm not done, Kyle. And what do you mean I miss the point of the Iron Man? What what fucking point is introducing a wasteful Mandarin character that ended up getting retconned anyway, and we got this stupid ass side plot where he's hanging out with a Furby. Like, get out of here with, like, what's the point of those Iron Man movies? What made Captain America work is because they drove the plot of the Avengers four, where you had the Winter Soldier program.
Jagger May:They brought together the civil war. Arguably, Captain America was never actually a stand alone trilogy because it was always him, and it's about someone else. His only movie that was just about him was one of his worst ones. You made codependent characters, and they only worked together. Whereas with Batman, they've always worked, and I am not done.
Jagger May:That only worked with the Infinity Saga. We they've been stumbling and bumbling to try to make everything work together, and now we look. We've got a fucking blackout. We got the kingpin doing wild shit in New York. Like, don't don't the Thunderbolts fucking live there?
Jagger May:And they're just and they had a whole like, there there's so many plot holes that are fucked with this universe that only worked one time, and we're gonna try to recreate that magic again? I don't think so. Now I'm done.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Wait. Wait. Wait. Jagger, your whole point is keep Pattinson separate, but bring in a new Batman for the DCU.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Make it work then.
Matthew Kopfhamer:All of what you just said is gonna happen anyway if that's what you really believe.
Jagger May:But the thing is, if what what's working with the Battenson verse right now is great. I wanna see more of that. I want more Battenson spin offs.
Matthew Kopfhamer:There's been one movie Uh-huh. And one show.
Jagger May:Oh, and they were fucking great, man. So now. Now now you have to change that trajectory of Reeves. Don't trump me, cough. Do not do that.
Jagger May:I'm not Kamala, dog. It's like is now Matt Reeves, who's already taken too fucking long to write a second movie, we have to, like, alright. I need you to change your plan, and I need you to make Corrin Sweat fit into this movie. I need you to make, Supergirl fit into whatever universe this is. James Gunn himself says that it torpedoes your writing when you have to force and shoehorn characters into there.
Jagger May:Shout out to Adam Warlock. Gonna happen
Matthew Kopfhamer:anyways. But he hang on. I gotta rebuttal to that. So that's the beauty of what I'm proposing is you can have a separate story, but still throw on Easter eggs that connect to the greater universe. I think I think you're right, Jugger.
Matthew Kopfhamer:I think that's what has kinda harmed Marvel in the past that they've tried to shoehorn too many characters, especially with their tag, you know, post credit scenes where they try to, oh, let's tease something, and it doesn't really fit to what the story really was being told. But, again, I go back to what I've said in previous podcasts where I trust James Gunn with this IP to not do that, not fall into that trap. So he can integrate these universes in a way that is dynamic and fluid without shoehorning himself into a corner. Whereas I agree with Alfredo, when you try to keep these separate universes contained, that's when you back yourself into a story corner. It's like, hey.
Matthew Kopfhamer:I wanna introduce this plot line that only really works if x y z character is in it. Oh, wait. They're in the greater DCU already. We can't really do that if we wanna keep it separate. So, again, integration at the end of the day is gonna create more opportunities for them to have fun, creative stories that aren't going to shoehorn themselves into a corner going out.
Matthew Kopfhamer:We can't use this character. We can't use this character. We can't use this storyline.
Matthew Kopfhamer:You know, Matt, I I have a question for you. None of what you said tells me that it needs to be Robert Pattinson, though. He just tells me you
Jagger May:need a Batman.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Do. Like, here's here's my big question. And and let me
Matthew Kopfhamer:let me Why muddy the waters? Answer this.
Jagger May:There are two waters, man. You know, and I get Let
Alfredo Brown:let let the let the moderator ask the question.
Matthew Kopfhamer:So here's your question. Ask
Alfredo Brown:the question, guys.
Jagger May:I think
Matthew Kopfhamer:I think you have to think about this as a movie. Right? Like, someone has to make and create a movie. A movie is ultimately films are art. We can debate that all we want.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Not a part part of this debate. How and I wanna both arguments, whichever side you want. How do you tonally take this gritty, dark, Gotham universe of the Penguin and the Batman and make of it just look put them side by side, the palettes of these two movies side by side. I'm not saying it's impossible. We've seen it before.
Matthew Kopfhamer:We've seen Marvel take something and then, like, add this guardians of the galaxy and Thor love and thunder humor and just like imbue that humor everywhere. But that changed and it worked, but it changed what happened to Marvel. How do you do that in this universe? Or do you not? Can you not
Matthew Kopfhamer:do I'll take
Matthew Kopfhamer:this first. It's really my question for both of y'all. Yeah. Go ahead, Matt.
Matthew Kopfhamer:So you what you see then is in a team up movie where Batman plays like the straight man to a funnier character, and that's where the humor works. Is instead of trying to change Batman to be a quippy, funnier guy, you make him the straight man to where somebody says something quippy, and Batman just stares at him and was like, no. So that's how you make that humor work. So you keep those two totally different because, again, Superman is the yin to Batman's yang, where Batman is the darker one. He sees the the he sees the dark possibilities of what happens when the justice league goes bad, where Superman's like, no.
Matthew Kopfhamer:It'll be fine. Like, we'll work together. Friendship overcome everything. And you can keep those separate. You've established now with the Matt verse bat you know, the Matt Reeves Batman universe that this is a Batman in his first couple years of being Batman.
Matthew Kopfhamer:And we're seeing the same thing with James Gunn's new Superman, where it's Superman at the beginning of his career. So, again, why change that? Those trajectories work together in parallel. So all you gotta do is then in a couple years, when a team up movie makes sense, don't do the don't do the thing where Snyder's like, oh, they hate each other just because. Just make it work.
Matthew Kopfhamer:And tonally, it will succeed.
Alfredo Brown:Miss mister Martin.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Fred, do have something to add before I I I let Jagger and Sam answer this question? Yeah. What you got?
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. If if I may. If I may. You asked about, tone, aesthetic. These things can sometimes get lost in the sauce when you start to bring in new directors that have their own vision when we see something that already works.
Alfredo Brown:This Gotham in the Batman was one of the most accurate portrayals of Gotham that we have ever seen. It felt like it was ripped right out of the comics. This version of Batman, for as much criticism as Robert Pattinson got prior to the role, felt like one of the most comic accurate versions of Batman, a recluse living in his cage his cave who is an actual detective and needed to be the world's greatest detective. Now this version of Batman can absolutely work in the DCU. Think of the Batman that we grew up with.
Alfredo Brown:Jag, cough, Sam, I'm not sure if you watched as well, but the DCAU, the DC Animated Universe, that Justice League, that Batman was never truly actually a full timer in the Justice League. He was, in every sense of the word, a vigilante, a man that fought crime under his own terms and was not part of that group. You can maintain the same tones of having a very different Gotham that is dark and gritty and nothing like the big shiny Metropolis while having a Batman that is dark, gritty, and nothing like the big shiny Superman. However, both these heroes can fight for the same thing, which is what we saw at the end of the Batman where he realized he can't just be vengeance. He needs to be a symbol of hope.
Alfredo Brown:And that's how those two heroes can coincide yet still be different in this DCU.
Jagger May:I would like to report false information.
Alfredo Brown:False information. Please fact check. Go
Matthew Kopfhamer:ahead, man.
Jagger May:Go on. I gotta fact check it. Batman was a founding member of the Justice League, but when they went and expanded
Alfredo Brown:Not a full timer.
Jagger May:Not a full timer. So it's I I mean, he technically was a full timer until the Vandal Savage thing, and then he, like, became like a part
Alfredo Brown:Even even when Amanda Waller and and Argus was trying to bring them in for allegedly bombing some I can't remember the exact story line, but bombing a government building. And all the Justice League was like, let's go turn ourselves in until the investigation's done. Batman's like, that's stupid. You guys go do that. If someone's claiming that you did something illegal, you go clear your name.
Alfredo Brown:I'm not doing that.
Jagger May:That's hilarious. And I'll let you have that one because that's one of my favorite scenes because, like, Batman literally, like, does smash Zoom, and he's like, what? You want me to go to the cops? Fuck. He's like, get fucked.
Jagger May:Okay. I'm done. I'm sorry. Hell yeah. Have it.
Jagger May:I could see. Right. You win. No. You win
Alfredo Brown:that point.
Jagger May:You win that point.
Samantha Holt:Point.
Jagger May:Jeez. Moderator had questions. Had something
Matthew Kopfhamer:to say or did I?
Samantha Holt:No. I just I think that I just feel like going back to what you had said earlier, Jagger, I want good storytelling for Batman, and I want good storytelling for Superman. And I feel like when you try to rush and everyone feels like it's trying to rush a Justice League, trying to rush things to go together, it's when you get mistakes. And what's so successful about this Batman in that it's bringing some parts of what Christopher Nolan's Batman did. Well, we've got a lot of the amazing tech and these different things.
Samantha Holt:He is grittier, this Patton's in Batman. I like that all of the villains, through both actually, don't rely on super strength, superpowers, super anything. They fall back on what makes them villains, which is whatever they're trying to cause. Bring Heath Ledger Heath Ledger's Joker in for the chaos in order to facilitate change in Gotham. You've got, obviously, Riddler with this latest Batman and turning him into more of this serial killer with an agenda type of villain, I don't think that you need any of these super strength, super speed, superpowers going into this because Gotham already has enough of that grittiness on its own without all of that in it.
Samantha Holt:And that's why I wanna keep them separate for as long as I can just because the story is so good and the characters are so good. No. You guys got to go back and forth. So Jack's
Jagger May:turn next. And and to more on your point there, when you think about Robert Pattinson, he is, like, our the next generation's Leonardo DiCaprio at this point, realistically. He is a heavy hitter actor. And I'm putting him ahead of someone like Robert Downey junior. I just don't think we can have him sign up for eight of these movies like we had with Robert, Robert Downey junior and Chris Evans and have a full fledged DCU like we got with the MCU and have a finished story with Batman.
Jagger May:I think we only got three Batman movies out of them. I want a cohesive Batverse with all these spin offs and not burn out my Robert Pattinson with, like, one liners with David Koren sweat. And I'm not saying I don't want that, but, again, I'm okay with having two Batman. I will I will buy the merch. Most Batman fans will be fine.
Jagger May:Like, I literally have, like, six different timelines in my head. Like, yeah. Like, right now, Alfredo's trying to act like he's not gonna watch two Batman at all. Like, it's just it's just a
Alfredo Brown:Oh, I'd watch seven Batman. That's not the point that we're making.
Jagger May:Write that down, Vince.
Alfredo Brown:I am not most fans.
Jagger May:Write that down. No. I mean, ever everyone it's a proven fact that we'll keep watching Batman no matter the quality. Look at the box office, man. Like, we're gonna go watch Batman.
Jagger May:The worst Batman
Alfredo Brown:That's like saying that's like saying we're gonna keep eating McDonald's, that's the only food we should have. Quality is still gonna be important.
Jagger May:Okay. It is. It is important, but,
Samantha Holt:like Way better than McDonald's.
Jagger May:I I think we're okay with Matt Reeves at this point, and I think we're okay with James Gunn. So I think we should just let both of these two cooks cook on their own. Make two dishes, and they're both are gonna be good. I don't I don't need to have a sushi burrito. Give me sushi.
Jagger May:Give me a fucking burrito. That's what I've been talking about.
Samantha Holt:That. Yeah. Let me enjoy two things for what they are separately and enjoy them completely. I don't need to rush to put them all together.
Jagger May:Exactly.
Matthew Kopfhamer:So you can But do you wanna watch a Batman and you don't wanna watch a Batman Peacemaker movie? It's like two hours of them just sitting there silently judging each
Jagger May:other. Yeah.
Matthew Kopfhamer:I just don't you don't
Jagger May:want that
Matthew Kopfhamer:or as much.
Samantha Holt:But I don't need it.
Alfredo Brown:Or so Or or how about Batman and
Matthew Kopfhamer:Booster Gold? They, like, solve a mystery, a time travel mystery together, and they're just, like, the whole time complaining about their costumes. Like, you know, there's great potential, guys. You could, know, put the universes together.
Samantha Holt:Again, back to what Jagger said though with how long we're gonna have Robert Pattinson as Batman. I don't think it makes sense to combine this Matt Reeves Batman with everything else that they're building. I am I am for if you need if you need a Batman to join this DCU that they're reworking, get a different one.
Jagger May:Allen Richton.
Samantha Holt:This one this one is spoken for in in all of its own I think you're fine.
Jagger May:Another good one. I would allow. Don't don't I think he he's totally built like absolute Batman, dude. If you if you had an absolute Batman, just this jacked
Alfredo Brown:But that's not but that's not what we're doing, though. That's not what this this story you know what? I'll I'll say
Matthew Kopfhamer:Adrian Brody. There you go.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Nope. Not again, dude. No. Maybe a Batman who laughs.
Samantha Holt:That what we're saying?
Alfredo Brown:Moderator, please.
Matthew Kopfhamer:So we've talked about we've talked about distinct stories. We've talked about artistic vision of different creators. We've talked about the tone. But, you know, how do you this is a good part of every debate. How do you avoiding any, you know, jargon and using sort of just like plain language principles?
Matthew Kopfhamer:How do you explain your case simply to someone who just doesn't really know much about anything? They just wanna watch a movie. They know Batman exists. They know DC exists. How do you make a case to someone who's not a big comic book fan to watch a movie if they're put together or to watch the movies if they're kept separate?
Matthew Kopfhamer:Because that's an important part of any debate. We Go ahead. It looks like you're ready. Yeah. You can go first, man.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Why do many Batman when one Batman work?
Jagger May:Okay. That was awful. I'll probably
Matthew Kopfhamer:That is one way to describe it to your grandma.
Samantha Holt:That's what you've been trying to interrupt us for for, like
Alfredo Brown:Yes.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Five minutes. But you said that
Alfredo Brown:finger up like, man, it's gonna be a banger. Dumb.
Jagger May:There's your tag.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Cutting that separately. Right? That's gotta be that's gotta be a clip right there. Yeah.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Just But, again,
Alfredo Brown:strong argument from
Matthew Kopfhamer:I do I do wanna go back to something that Jags said with the Sony, you know, Spider Man having multiple Spider Man could be a good thing. I disagree. The only reason we have that many Spider Man is because of the stupid fucking rights dispute between Fox, Sony, and Marvel or whoever. Like, there's that was a money dispute, and that's why it had to get written that way. We don't have that issue with Batman right now.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Again, why are we trying to muddy the waters when we already have a successful Batman and we're going to have this new DCU? Why are we trying to to have multiple iterations of the same character? Just take the successful character you already have and make it fit with what you're going to use your new universe. It's not like we're trying to pick take a round peg and fit into a square hole. Like, we have the pieces that will work together well.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Do it. And you don't have to worry about this confusion of we have multiple Batmans. We have multiple storylines. Just make it one cohesive storyline, and you can then explore that universe fully instead of being separated and siloed.
Jagger May:Alfredo, do you wanna an actually answer Vic's question before we
Alfredo Brown:do Yeah. I was gonna say to answer the question that was, that was given here, I mean, the best way to have the uninitiated understand what Batman truly is is to give us the simplest and most basic form of what Batman really is, which is a detective. And that's what we got in Matt Reeves, the Batman. And the way that you're able to bring that over into this new DCU is to simply bring that same character over and stop giving us a second Batman who's not just going to be Batman. It's going to be Batman the brave and the bull.
Alfredo Brown:Bull, Batman. We're we're going to have we're going to have daddy Batman with Damian Wayne. So not only do you have to get introduced to a new character in a new Batman and a new Alfred and a new Gotham and a new DCU, but now you've got a brand new Robin that's never been portrayed on screen, which, by the way, Damian Wayne, my favorite Robin. Robin. I think it can be a really
Jagger May:what what? He said he's the fourth Robin. I have something
Matthew Kopfhamer:He's the fourth iteration.
Jagger May:Sorry. I'm help proving your point. I gotta stop. I was gonna say, Jack, you're you're helping him, Jagger. Jagger.
Alfredo Brown:And it's it is more characters for us to get to know when simply the public has spoken. The public ate this first meal, the Batman. They even had a side course of the penguin. We've loved it. We've loved every bite of the Matt Reeves universe.
Alfredo Brown:Why should this not continue into the DCU, especially when James Gunnas said, the most difficult thing about running the DC studios right now is what to do with Batman. My guy, you've already got your solution right in front of you. Just plug it in. That that's it.
Jagger May:Sam, you got anything? I don't need sunshine, Shammy. I need Sammy, I need, like, thunder and lightning and cloudy
Alfredo Brown:Go for the jugular.
Matthew Kopfhamer:You got you ain't got nothing. You got nothing because you know
Samantha Holt:I just don't understand how you think that I mean, we haven't seen this new Superman yet. We haven't. We've seen a trailer. No. Right?
Samantha Holt:We've seen trailers, multiple trailers. You talk about how do we merge palettes. You don't. You can't merge them. It is square peg round hole.
Samantha Holt:It is it is dark and gritty, and it is fun and fantastical. It doesn't make sense. And it actually, I think, would cause more confusion for viewers to answer your question, Vic. I think it would be more confusing to try and combine them for viewers. I think the reasons why people like this Batman are standalone, and the reasons why people are gonna like this new Superman are standalone.
Samantha Holt:So allow Superman's world to keep growing because it seems like being off planet, he needs more people, and he needs more to kind of add to his story. Gotham being singular and the world for Batman being Gotham, and he needs to protect his house, protect his people, and build it from the ground up. He doesn't need anything else. Batman doesn't need Superman. Superman doesn't really need Batman, so keep them separate because it'll be easier for audiences as well to go from this bright, beautiful, colorful, just going off of the trailer for Superman and a a magic dog that is also gonna be in there too.
Samantha Holt:An alien dog that's gonna jump in and save the world to to a Batman that's like, yeah. You just blew up all the evidence. I'm trying to get this guy to go to jail. We're trying to prosecute him. What are we doing here?
Samantha Holt:We're not just gonna go in and blow stuff up. We're due processing in our Batman way. Keep them separate.
Jagger May:And, again, to my final point to answer Vic's question, a big thing that we haven't brought up is fatigue. And a huge thing that is keeping fans from watching new things is fatigue and having to do homework. Whereas you can go and watch whatever James Gunn does, what's for itself. But if someone says, like, I don't give a fuck. I know nothing about Green Lantern.
Jagger May:I know nothing about booster gold. I I really just love Batman. I can just go and watch this Batman and Batman universe and enjoy that without having to watch, an animated mister Miracle Show, all this other shit that we have going on. I can ingest enjoy Batman. That's the that's the, one of the big upsides of having exclusive universe.
Jagger May:You could play whether you're reading a comic or watching a movie or television, you could just start a episode one on something and just fucking read it and stay on that same track. You don't have to go and watch this team up or watch this team up. Learn about characters that you just don't like. And that's what I think fans want more of now and not the MCU, oh, fuck. Gotta download Disney plus for these two shows that I'm gonna be disappointed in.
Jagger May:Yeah.
Alfredo Brown:Shout out Ironheart.
Matthew Kopfhamer:But but aren't but isn't the whole concept of the DC is that Batman will eventually be introduced to it?
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. Thank you.
Jagger May:So But it's of your
Matthew Kopfhamer:points are moved
Jagger May:because But the no. It's the thing is you can have like, what you're saying is what, you could only have sushi or you could only have burritos. That's all you can have for the rest of your life, and that's just fundamentally not true. They're two different things that you can enjoy at
Matthew Kopfhamer:your own speed.
Alfredo Brown:No. I I think if anything, we're making a a a different argument for a sushi burrito here, which I would not make that argument in real life, but I would I would say if we're doing the analogy thing, we're arguing for a sushirito. Okay. We're arguing for fusion here. I I I'll say this.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Bet the Look. Eventually, Batman's going to the DCU. Do you want the Batman that we like and has been established and is good, or do you want the possibility that they just slap something together in the hopes that it's good?
Samantha Holt:And it turns out slap him in there, and it's gonna be bad. You're gonna be adding him into it's like, you know, when you get a goldfish, you're supposed to let the bag sit in the water a little bit before you, like, put him in the water so he doesn't die.
Alfredo Brown:That's what's gonna happen to Batman. Yeah.
Samantha Holt:Yeah. You're gonna do try and throw you're gonna try and throw Batman in there, and it's just gonna go to shit. And, again, I don't feel like you're gonna have
Matthew Kopfhamer:Again, Batman's going into the DCU.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Do you want the version we
Matthew Kopfhamer:like already? I
Samantha Holt:don't want this one in there. Wait, cough.
Jagger May:Don't ask a little
Matthew Kopfhamer:Okay. So you want
Alfredo Brown:Mister moderator.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Mister Meyer, got a question for you. Cough. You've contradicted yourself a little bit. So I'm gonna give you a chance to uncontradict yourself. You have claimed in in different words that in James Gunn, we trust.
Matthew Kopfhamer:That you believe that he can do a great job putting Batman into the DCU. If that is the case, why must it be Pattinson's Batman? Why can he not create his own Batman into the DCU? Because you're you're just saying he's gonna be there anyway. I agree.
Matthew Kopfhamer:You can't have a good Justice League without a Batman. Whether he's part time, full time, I don't really care. You need the Batman. But does he need to be the Batman from Robert Pattinson? Do you not trust James Gunn?
Matthew Kopfhamer:That's my question to you.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Okay. So those are slightly two different points. While I do trust James Gunn with this overall DCU, I think it would be a giant misstep for him to try to recast a Batman when there's already an established Batman Okay. In Fair the DC. Right now, they are two separate silos, but I think it would be a giant misstep if you don't take the successful Pattinson and bring him into the greater universe.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Okay. Fair point. Well, I think what go ahead, Alfredo.
Alfredo Brown:I was gonna basically May may I elaborate on that?
Matthew Kopfhamer:Just Yeah. Sure.
Jagger May:Go ahead.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Little bit. Yeah. Oh, no.
Alfredo Brown:You know what? Let's go let's let's go no. Let's go into closing arguments then, Vince.
Matthew Kopfhamer:That's what I was gonna say. Yeah. Let's get into closing arguments. Put it all together. Try to make your best case.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Let them go first.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Yep. They do get to go first as time as started.
Alfredo Brown:Started off. Just let let mister moderator do his job. He's good at it. Doctor moderator. Sir.
Alfredo Brown:Sorry, sir.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Doctor moderator.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Okay. So Jagger, Sam, what do y'all got? Make your case. You made a lot of really great points. I agree with both groups.
Matthew Kopfhamer:I actually came in with the bias, and now I'm not sure what my bias is anymore because I see it, I kinda see it both ways. But, yeah, make your fine this I'm clean slate now. This is it. Convince me of your side. Are we putting these guys together?
Matthew Kopfhamer:Are we keeping them separate?
Samantha Holt:No. We're keeping them separate because we enjoy the worlds as they are on their own. If Batman ends up getting brought in to this new universe, Superman, fine, but let it be a different Batman. I wanna keep my mob boss world Batman on its own. I wanna keep it without the fantastical.
Samantha Holt:I wanna keep it to the detective side, which is what we do love so much about Batman. I feel like that gets muddied when you add in all of this fantastical world to it. And I love the villains that are based off of people that have issues, deep seated issues. They have other mental illness. They have their serial killers.
Samantha Holt:They're these guys that just are out for themselves and their own benefit. I want more of those types of villains and criminals in my Batman universe. So I wanna keep it precious and separate from this magical world that Superman is about to take us into.
Jagger May:Exactly. It's more that I I love the direction that the Reeves verse has gone, and I want it to keep going in that direction without having to shoehorn it into something else. And to give you and agree with the point, I trust James Gunn enough to where his other Batman will just be something else that I enjoy for what it is. It I get the best of both worlds. And I and I don't necessarily need Robert Pattinson to legitimately Hannah Montana it.
Jagger May:You know, go out and to, like, the the the bright bold Justice League, and then come back to Gotham and put on his eye black and and Nirvana. I don't I don't really need those two vibes to to do that. You know, I can have two things, and all I do is just get more Batman. I get more content to enjoy. Unbenched has more episodes.
Jagger May:Yeah. I get two Christmases. I have two dads now. That means two Christmases. And I want both of them to compete for my love.
Samantha Holt:I'm team two dads. I'm team two dads. Yes.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Team divorce. Got it. Oh, man. You guys are for separation.
Samantha Holt:Team Christmases.
Jagger May:Yeah. We're just gonna love.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Alfredo, cough. When do y'all wanna go first? You're you're closing I'll let Alfredo cook.
Alfredo Brown:You're you're sure?
Matthew Kopfhamer:Yeah. I I yield all my time to you, Alfredo.
Alfredo Brown:Okay. Let's do this.
Jagger May:That's well
Matthew Kopfhamer:All the time. Okay. So cops not doing a closing argument. Okay. Nope.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Okay. I trust Alfredo.
Alfredo Brown:Let's do this. So first thing, you know, James, we talk about this. We oh, and I've got an answer for that, mister moderator. We discuss the Matt Reeves bat verse here as if it is not already part of DC and the DC studios under James Gunn's umbrella. A man whom he's already working with, a man whom he has familiarity with.
Alfredo Brown:It is an easy thing to make this Batman part of the current DCU. Furthermore, we talk about how this Batman is gritty and dark and puts on his eye black and listens to Nirvana and goes back into his cave. That Batman also experienced growth in a single movie where towards the end of it, he already knew he had to be a different character. Now these characters and this aesthetic can exist in two separate worlds. In James Gunn's DCU, this can work.
Alfredo Brown:However, we have the trust in James Gunn. We have the trust in Matt Reeves. If we know we trust these two men, we can let them work together. Whom I do not have the trust in is Andy Muschetti, the man that is that is slated to direct this movie. Now he put out a good movie with it part one and part two.
Alfredo Brown:Those were fun. Those were stories that were already written for him. All he had to do was just not fuck up the recipe. Cook it, take it to the table, put the the fries in the bag, my man. Zach Snyder.
Alfredo Brown:And he he sure. Sure. Zach Snyder. Why why not? Yeah.
Alfredo Brown:His other experiences were a horror film, Mama. I have not seen it. I cannot tell you whether it's good or not.
Jagger May:He made that movie? It's dog shit. Oh, sorry. I just Oh, it's terrible.
Alfredo Brown:There we go. Right now right now, Andy Muschetti has been the director of four films. It part one, It part two, Mama, and February The Flash. The movie that was set to save Zack Snyder's DCEU at the time with multiple Batman, multiple iterations of this character that we love. We need to bring some consistency.
Alfredo Brown:We need to bring some stability to this character that fans love. And the character that we already love right now, Robert Pattinson's Batman and Matt Reeves' Bat Universe need to become part of this new DCU that we will love. Thank you, mister moderator.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Man, so I just have to add one random random thing about Andy Muschetti. He also was the executive producer for Electric State, which hopefully Yes. No one ever wants.
Alfredo Brown:I had that written down too.
Matthew Kopfhamer:You did. Okay. Was a okay.
Alfredo Brown:Not great. Not great.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Not great. Don't
Jagger May:like I said, I don't intentionally watch bad movies. It it was not by design.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Electric State happened to be, happened to be an accidental watch while I was I was caught in a bad spot. Okay. Lots of phenomenal arguments here. Right? We have an outstanding, outstanding Matt Reeves verse already in existence.
Matthew Kopfhamer:We have a lot of hope for what the rest of James Gunn's Superman and Beyond stuff is gonna be. We believe and trust in both of them to be able to do what they need to do. But the core arguments that I'm hearing here are really about, do we wanna mess with the story that we have with Matt Reeves? Do we wanna mess with what we have in this, like, well contained Gotham? Do we need a new Batman?
Matthew Kopfhamer:And this is really tough. Now I'm expected to declare a winner. Is that right? You wanna make me declare a winner for sure here?
Alfredo Brown:Yes. You
Matthew Kopfhamer:have to.
Alfredo Brown:Okay. Yes.
Matthew Kopfhamer:I came in with pretty strong biases. I spent a lot of time reading about this yesterday, thinking about it, and I really, really wanted to have Matt Reeves' verse collide with James Gunn. I wanted Matt Reeves' Batman to be in I wanted Robert Pattinson in the in in the DCU because I was like, this would be incredible if you could pull it off. But I will be honest after hearing all of these arguments, I gotta turn I am
Alfredo Brown:very bored. This is rigged.
Jagger May:Team Saturday.
Matthew Kopfhamer:This is rigged.
Alfredo Brown:This is rigged.
Matthew Kopfhamer:I think I think Alfredo and pop game, if passion to please, made really great arguments. But I I I love books. I love reading these stuff. And the comics themselves, if we are gonna pay homage to the comics and how all of these are comic book based, comics had millions of different self contained stories, and they did a really good job. And, ultimately, I want great writing, great stories, and I don't wanna mess with a good thing.
Matthew Kopfhamer:They may merge them together. And I trust that if they do, they will do it well, but I don't think they should. Sorry, guys. But also not selling, guys.
Alfredo Brown:Absolutely racist.
Samantha Holt:One of us.
Matthew Kopfhamer:Absolutely racist over there.
Jagger May:Well, I'll say this.
Alfredo Brown:I'll say this. Even though even though nope. Nope. Cough.
Jagger May:You want segregation?
Alfredo Brown:Two minute time out for you.
Jagger May:Want segregation.
Alfredo Brown:Nope. Nope. You know what?
Jagger May:Alright. You're you're timed out.
Alfredo Brown:And you've you've been muted. There we go. Cough time out right now. You know what, though? I think that we we all come from this saying the same thing and believing the same thing about this beloved character, Batman.
Alfredo Brown:Is that, one, we love this iteration that we got from Robert Pattinson, that we got from Matt Reeves. Two, we are excited for what we can get from James Gunn and his DCU. And, honestly, all this does is lead up to more hype for the upcoming Superman movie. I'm so excited for that, guys. I know all of us are too, and we're gonna be covering that too.
Alfredo Brown:Like, we're gonna be talking more about the Superman upcoming Superman movie, what can come of that with the DCU, the characters that are going to get integrated into that story as well. And and we'll be keeping up with all the news that that comes out from from this new potential Batman. I know we're gonna see a lot of that in the next coming days. The team that won, JAG, Sam, you guys wanna you guys wanna say your piece here?
Samantha Holt:Cool. I feel like we said it because we won.
Jagger May:Yeah. Cool.
Alfredo Brown:Alright. Well, it's official. The red team wins this debate that we will and we should get a new Batman, the brave and the bold for James Gunn's DCU. As always, I wanna thank everybody for watching and listening all the way through. For myself, for cough, we lost.
Alfredo Brown:For Vig, the bullshit result. JAG, Sam, we'll see you next time. Adios.
