On today's episode, we're giving you a review and breakdown of the fantastic four, the first steps. We're gonna tell you guys what we thought of the characters, specifically Pedro Pascal as Reed Richards, how this fits into the upcoming MCU movies, and give you our theories about that credit scene. All that more on an auto upset of Unbringed starting now.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:This is a full spoiler review of the fantastic four movie and everything else that's related to it in the MCU, including a post credit scene, so proceed with caution.
Alfredo Brown:I think the overwhelming thoughts are positive. But, Sam, I wanna start with you. You've got you've got this cool voice thing going on today.
Samantha Holt:Very, very deep voice today. You wanna start with me on what my overall score of the film was? I mean
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. Yeah.
Samantha Holt:I really, really enjoyed it. And I definitely think I enjoyed it more than I thought I would, especially with the world that they created. This specific planet with the time period that it was in with all of the science at hand, I wanna say based on the timeline. It was interesting to me. I think I wanna give it like a solid I wanna I wanna give it a nine.
Samantha Holt:I wanna give it a nine, but I feel like there's gonna be reasons that I wanna bring it down to like an 8.5 as we talk through it. So I'll land 8.5 because it was really fun. I really enjoyed the comedy moments in it. But there were some things that kind of annoyed me in terms of the story and how things were solved. But I'll save that for later.
Alfredo Brown:Koff, what do you think?
Matt Kopfhamer:Yeah. I'll give it a solid eight. I think it was well acted. It was, well choreographed. The story was entertaining.
Matt Kopfhamer:There's a few things that I didn't quite like about it, but we'll get into that later. So, yeah, I'll give it an eight.
Alfredo Brown:Vegasaurus Rex?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Same. I gotta go with an eight. I really enjoyed it. I had an absolute blast while watching this movie, but at the same time, they just like some minor questionable things and some hand wavy things and other stuff that we'll talk about a little bit later, but this was a great movie and I had a blast.
Alfredo Brown:You know what? I'm gonna let Jack go last because I feel like we've got something good coming. This is gonna be our our review post credit scene here. So, I'm I'm just gonna go here. I also give it an eight.
Alfredo Brown:Some of it might have been messed up by my experience of watching the movie late at night alone in the theater. I'll talk about yeah. I'll talk about that later, like, at the end. Audio version people. If you're not subscribed to the podcast side of this, go over and check that out because I'm I'm gonna give you a whole story about that.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. Like, there was just enough things where I just it felt like there was an ingredient missing from the dish when I finished consuming it. So I'm gonna give us an eight. It was a good film. There's a lot to talk about.
Alfredo Brown:Jag, everyone clear out. Jag, ball up top. ISO.
Jagger May:Right now, I'm at a 6.5, but I think I can come up to seven as we talk through here.
Alfredo Brown:This is content.
Jagger May:And a lot of this is I felt that the film was a little bit lifeless at points of it, and I just felt like it was missing action. I remember, like, I watched it late too. There was times where I thought I'd I'd dozed off. Like, I didn't. I wasn't and to keep in mind, it wasn't boring where I'd sleep through it, but I could have just straight up slept through fifteen minutes and not missed anything throughout that film.
Jagger May:And I didn't get to see the fantastic four be the fantastic four, a whole lot. And then when I did, at least half the team didn't feel like the source material that I grew up with. And I'm not trying to be that nerd, and I do like having diversity, or just changing stuff up for the name of a movie. But I do think that Fantastic Four is so pivotal to Marvel that they didn't quite hit the expectations that I think they should have hit.
Alfredo Brown:Guys, do you think there's sort of, like, a sliding scale where we've moved the goalpost now where it's like Marvel has struggled for so long that finally we got something that is is kinda decent, and we're like, that's an eight. Marvel's back. Like, are are we doing that a little bit here? Because I had a lot of the same feelings that Jag did. And then the more I kinda just let let let the steak rest here and just let fantastic four marinate in my mind, I was like, you know what?
Alfredo Brown:It wasn't as bad as I thought. But I had a lot of the same concerns where it's kinda like throughout the middle of it, I'm like, damn. They're doing a lot of talking. It's just a lot of talking, a lot of Pedro Pascal going, maybe this works. It probably doesn't.
Alfredo Brown:Maybe this works. It probably doesn't. It felt very comic booky, in many positive ways, but then that was one of the the negative ways where I'm just like, man, this felt like like a book where I wanted to skip some of these chapters. Sam, I saw you nodding your head. Does this feel like we've maybe moved the goalpost a little bit for Marvel here?
Samantha Holt:I feel like I feel like it did in terms of going back to you know, Marvel's also and the Avengers and all that have all been about family and moving towards a greater good and different things. And there was a big family element to this one that I felt had a lot of heart to it. I do agree there was a lot of talking. And I felt like some of the action scenes to me or some even the solve at the end for Galactus just getting to shove him into somewhere else. We don't know where.
Samantha Holt:Just kind of felt like too easy. But at the same time, like, isn't he just gonna come back because he's Galactus and he's just gonna go and eat another planet? Doesn't actually solve the problem. So part of that was just, I guess, extending the Marvel. Oh, he's just gonna come back again because you didn't actually eliminate the problem, which I think kind of is the thing that now with the worlds being everywhere.
Samantha Holt:That's just the constant problem of like, well, they'll just gonna come back again. And it doesn't feel like there's much resolution.
Matt Kopfhamer:They do talk about that though. They know it's only a temporary solution, but that temporary solution in Reed's estimation was like two million years. It would take Galactus to get like from the other side of the universe without his ship back to Earth. So it's like, by then, who cares? It's not it's no longer their problem.
Matt Kopfhamer:So
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Yeah. But there's a It is
Matt Kopfhamer:a little hand wavy. It is a little hand wavy. Yeah. It's a little hand wavy, especially since he has the power cosmic, but, you know, whatever.
Jagger May:And to push back on or to answer your question, Alfredo, I don't think I've moved the goalpost because Thunderbolts left me feeling just, and I'm not saying I felt bad after fantastic four. I I get was by no means a bad movie. I just felt on top of the moon when I after I left Thunderbolts, and I felt like things were back. I didn't have that with fantastic four because I I I know that they can do that. And and that's why I'm saying I haven't moved the bar.
Jagger May:I just I just to me, in my opinion, they just didn't do a good enough job with this movie. They had to cut scenes. They had to do a lot. They just didn't do a good enough job. Thunderbolts, they knocked out of the park.
Jagger May:I know Marvel can do it. That's why if anything, I'm not gonna move the goalpost or lower the goalpost form just because they did good enough. And that sounds harsh. I didn't mean for that to come out harsh.
Alfredo Brown:No. I I felt the same way. Yeah. Go go, Koff.
Matt Kopfhamer:Sorry. I was just gonna say, you know, exactly. Coming out of Thunderbolts, especially with the post credit scene where you see the ship, like, there was that level of excitement going into Fantastic Four that was like, okay, how is this gonna connect? And they get through the whole movie and I even put it in the group chat. I was like, you know, fun movie.
Matt Kopfhamer:I had a good time. I just it's almost and I know it's on purpose, but it is separate from the MCU, and I see no way how they're gonna connect it other than possibly doom somehow siphoning Franklin's power to open a wormhole into another I think it's
Alfredo Brown:exactly it. Yeah. That's what happens. That that's exactly
Jagger May:Still, I feel like I think that's okay.
Matt Kopfhamer:We we deep dive into this so we we can go that route, but a lot of casual fans, I feel like, are still at that point where they're like, how is any of this connect? And I think they didn't do a good enough job of placing those breadcrumbs to make it connect.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Alright. Can I can I, like, answer all these things a little bit?
Matt Kopfhamer:Go for it.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Alright. I'm gonna I didn't move the goalpost. I'm with Jagger. I I really didn't. I thought this was a fun movie.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I think it serves its own purpose. I like that they did the same thing as Superman did. Didn't give me the same origin story that three other movies have done. They kinda did, of course. Right?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:But they did it in a different way with Mark Gattis and his Ted Gilbert show or whatever that was. So I think it was an eight. Questionable decisions. You could actually talk me down to a seven and a half. But, Matt, you know, I think that a lot of people don't watch Thunderbolts.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:They're not a brand. A lot of people barely even watch Fantastic Four the first few times, but this one has been watched so well that it has grossed more, first off, more internationally than all the Superman like, the Superman movie that just came out. This gross more than all the other Fantastic Four movies put together, and a lot of that has, like, word-of-mouth and people enjoying this. People don't wanna do a ton of homework then. Problem.
Alfredo Brown:If if we're being real.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Like, there's a
Alfredo Brown:little too much red, white, and blue going on with
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Superman. People don't want to do a ton of homework. The MCU is 37 movies deep, and I like that if you hadn't seen Thunderbolts, you thought this was okay. And clearly, we know that they're arriving in their ships, and we already are warned that they will return in Avengers Doomsday, which, you know, is coming out later next year. So I'm okay with some of that stuff.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I I think this was a nice little self contained movie, and I think that they gave enough stuff there for the comic book nerds. Right? You got Franklin. You know he can create spoilers, I guess. Pocket universes in his bedroom, and, you know, Franklin is one of the most powerful in all of Marvel.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:And we see Doom, I think, which I think was a nice little teaser. Right? At the end of the credit, we'll talk about that a little bit more. So certainly a lot of hand wavy things. I mean, I could probably go on, like, a ten minute rant of all the hand hand wavy things they did in this movie.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:But that's comic books, man. Maybe sometimes we've, like, moved away from the hand wavy nature of comics and how things just happen and how bad guys actually don't die. You do just banish them away, and they come back whenever they feel like because you need to keep them going. Actually, that was a really good comic book movie that hits for the fans who like comic book movies, but don't necessarily like comic books, if that makes sense. Like, Marvel made these kind of movies mainstream.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Everybody watches them now. So the lore masters are really hurt. This is not a great fantastic four source movie. We'll talk about those sort of things.
Alfredo Brown:That's
Vignesh Doraiswamy:right. But, yeah, the lore masters probably didn't love it. Jagger, you can tell me more. You gave us a low score, and I love fantastic four, but I didn't treat this as a comic book nerd fan score. This was my fan of movies score, and there was a lot of stuff I didn't love.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:But I came out and I reflected, and I was like, you know what? I gave Superman a 10. This wasn't that great. I really had a good time. I loved the heart and soul and family that they talked about.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Maybe because I was a new dad, man. Some of that stuff with the kid, even though it was terrible CGI, hit hard. Hit hard. It was a fun movie.
Jagger May:And I will say that this is why I said I could be like, I'm probably gonna finish with at it as a seven because that extra half point is me. I was like, this just, I feel like you guys still didn't see what I grew up with. Like, you you still didn't see it, and we didn't. And it's just not
Vignesh Doraiswamy:as good.
Jagger May:Like, I'm just sorry. It's not as good. And I'm normally not that type of dude with this. But, like, the big thing for me is the action that I just thought was lacking in there because, like, I don't was the red ghost stuff that bad, man? Because Reed Richards only does mister fantastic stuff.
Jagger May:Like, maybe, like, he he does some stretchy shit maybe twice in that whole movie. And then and then at the end of it That's the
Matt Kopfhamer:only that's the only thing he did.
Jagger May:They nerf him, dude. Like, the fact that they only have him stretch Armstrong long. I'm like, that's to me, that's it's a little bit egregious. It's if there's one thing going against source material, but, like, that's his whole fucking power besides being the smartest man in the world. That that's the stuff that bothered me a little bit.
Jagger May:And, like, I will give I'm harsh on Pedro Pascal. You guys know I've been that since they casted him. The the one time they could have given him justice is when he's building the crib, and they said, like, I thought you were gonna build the crib. And he said, anybody build a anybody can build a crib. Only I can do this.
Jagger May:That was the one time I saw Reed Richards, where Reed is this goofy ass nerd everywhere else, where he's not even really that good at being like this fucking celebrity. But when he's in the lab doing stuff, he's kind of an asshole. He's a total asshole. And that and that's the dichotomy. It's the Clark Kent versus Superman thing that's hard with Reed Richards.
Jagger May:And I will admit that I'm a little bit hard on this on this movie because of it.
Matt Kopfhamer:So we we talked a little bit in the group chat about that that whole thing, like Reed Richards. Who would you rather see as Reed Richards than Pedro Pascal? Because I I Murphy
Jagger May:is what you said. Actually, like, you cooked with that one. You had another one. I'm like, that's actually perfect because yeah.
Matt Kopfhamer:Yep. That's if that I think
Vignesh Doraiswamy:this is a have happened. Problem, or I I don't think this is Pedro problem. I think he was just poorly written. I agree with Jagger here.
Matt Kopfhamer:Like Yeah. Well, I'm really unsure.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Like, he's the smartest smartest character in all of Marvel, you could argue. And they just, like, they did really nerf him. And we're gonna get into characters a little bit later, but I I just wanna reiterate, I don't think this is a Pedro issue. We have seen the range that this guy has and the acting he can do. Maybe we're all a little Pedro ed out with him being in everything.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:But I really think that he and we'll get into it. I just think he was poorly written, and I agree. Like, I didn't get to see the Fantastic Four. I didn't get to see mister you know, it was Pedro's
Matt Kopfhamer:too charismatic for mister Fantastic. Like, let's be honest. Mister Fantastic is a awkward fucking super nerd who just happens to be really fucking handsome. Like, that's that's what it is. So you you need somebody so you need somebody like Killian Murphy who can give you that gravitas as that character who's also conventionally attractive and can give you those fucking awkward thousand yard Oppenheimer stares when you ask him a question and he's looking at you like you're the dumbest person he's ever met.
Matt Kopfhamer:Whereas Pedro looks at you and you're like, I still wanna make love to you, baby. Like, he can't help it. Those are his eyes. Everyone he looks at, that's how he sees you.
Samantha Holt:He's got the bedroom eyes.
Alfredo Brown:He does. Cough, do you need a moment alone?
Jagger May:Like, what's going buddy?
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. Don't stand up.
Matt Kopfhamer:Nope. Got no answer.
Alfredo Brown:Look. I look at it this way with the characters, and I and I think a lot of it is an injustice of the movie itself. And there's so many things that were said here that I kinda wanna, like, wrap it together with a bow is, one, I feel like the first thirty minutes of the movie is the trailer. Like, we we saw the first thirty of the minutes of the movie. Like, we knew what was happening, which doesn't excite me as a moviegoer, which is why, Jag, I think you and I were in the same spot where we got to, like, the thirty five minute mark, and I was like, well, damn.
Alfredo Brown:Okay. Well, what's happening now? The the movie to me didn't start until they went into space. And and they're and they're, you know, going faster than the speed of light to go find Galactus and do the negotiation. And that's a cool scene where they're trying to escape his ship and all that.
Alfredo Brown:Like, that was that was dope. I absolutely loved that. But then right after you get that peak of excitement, you go into, like, another twenty minutes of, like, just Reed and Sue going back and forth. Like, what are our options? And, yeah, it I don't think there was a moment there where I really felt like Reed was the smartest man on Earth.
Alfredo Brown:He just kinda felt like the smartest man available in New York at the time. Yes. Like, it it just it didn't feel like this man had a great command over what was happening in in the world and and for the world and everyone, different countries to just follow so easily. I think that was another one of the hand wavy things where it's just like even his own wife, which that's just marriage, by the way. Like, I can be right 10 times out of 10.
Alfredo Brown:And my wife's like, Fuck you, you're wrong about that. It just it just happens. Like, it's that that that personal level of it. But I think what ends up happening is, is, Jack, you asked about the red ghost stuff. This movie had so much cut from it.
Alfredo Brown:You can tell you could tell this was down to the bare bones. Like, this was probably a three hour movie. Like, this was a Snyder movie at first, probably.
Matt Kopfhamer:It was the Snyder cut.
Alfredo Brown:They cut so much of it with Natasha Lyons character with Red Ghost, more with Moleman. Like, there was so many other things here that it felt like the stuff they did focus on was just a lot of Reid being mopey. And I think that didn't lend itself well to Pedro Pascal who, cough, as you said, is such a charismatic actor. And he had to tone it down where you're watching this guy basically not be his normal self. Even the voice he was speaking in was a little bit different.
Alfredo Brown:Like, he almost had to tone it down to be softer and pretend to be this other person where it's like you actually and this I hate to say this, but you actually felt like he was acting, not like he was the character. And that's not a typical thing for Pedro Pascal. That is very good actor.
Jagger May:Thank you, Alfredo. Yeah. You nailed that because, like, his voice right away, when I heard it, I'm like, oh, that's different. He's trying. You know?
Jagger May:And that and then that's that's like, you shouldn't say that. You know? Like, that that should not be your first thought.
Matt Kopfhamer:It shouldn't be noticeable.
Alfredo Brown:I think I think his Joel Miller is closer to the version of Reed that we probably wanted. Yes. And it's like, dude, you already knew how to play that role. Just be kind of the asshole. It's my way or the highway.
Alfredo Brown:I'm the smartest one in the group. I run this town. Like, we had it.
Matt Kopfhamer:Just be
Jagger May:slightest rough. Just remove the Texas
Alfredo Brown:out of there, and you're good. Yeah.
Jagger May:Yep. And and try to
Vignesh Doraiswamy:be I got a question for Sam here.
Jagger May:Oh, yeah.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Go ahead, Jagger.
Jagger May:Yeah. Well, I'll say one thing is that Reed Richards is Lex Luther if he was a good person. I didn't say a nice person. I said a good person. Yep.
Matt Kopfhamer:Right. Right. Right.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Even better, he's act I mean, he's like, he's almost in a way the you know, the economy is him, and I've always thought of, like, Victor Von Doom. The same amount of hubris and vanity and, like, extreme intelligence and the, you know
Alfredo Brown:They're two sides of the same question for you.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Because you're the only one who brought up the heart of the movie, and maybe because I'm a new dad with an infant, that really does change a lot of stuff. You know, if you're not really, really familiar with the Reed Richards that you wanted, that everybody wants, and, like, you've read all this stuff. And I don't know, Sam, if you have or you haven't, but since you brought up the heart, I'm gonna ask you this. I was okay with this portrayal. Being a father changes you in ways you can't describe.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:And there is a shift from before the child is born and after the child is born in the kind of comments he makes, the kind of stuff he says. He makes mental lapses. Right? You really think the smartest man in the world wouldn't have thought that going and telling the world, oh, by the way, we could have stopped this if I gave up my kid, but I didn't give up my kid. Like, would he have said that to everybody?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I saw that. I'm like, this is the dumbest thing I've seen from the smartest alleged smartest man in the world.
Jagger May:Named, dumb. So I actually
Vignesh Doraiswamy:think yeah. That's exactly. Exactly. So I think I don't wanna say that's hand wavy, but I think they brought maybe a different version of Realism. Reed Richards that we haven't really seen in a sort of realism there that is very different.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:But I enjoyed that portrayal. Y'all And have all given your thoughts. Was other reason I wanted to ask Sam. Sam, your thoughts on Reed Richard.
Alfredo Brown:I mean
Vignesh Doraiswamy:As someone else who loved the heart of
Alfredo Brown:Yes. The
Samantha Holt:I and I think because there was a specific parts that I liked more, yeah, I didn't feel I wouldn't say that I felt like he wasn't lacking. I did feel like, okay, if you're the smartest man here, I feel like you should be doing better than what you're doing right now. But to your point
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Totally agree.
Samantha Holt:Was definitely showing a tiny bit of arrogance, more intelligence before the child arrives. And then after, he's just a little bit flail y and kind of panicky. And I think that does kind of go to, I don't know how to solve this because now I'm dealing with, you know, emotions. And if, you know, you've ever dated a guy that doesn't have a lot of emotions, they sometimes don't know what to do with those things and then make bad decisions. And it just kind of felt like a little bit of that.
Samantha Holt:And so that's why I was like, oh, I've seen this before. Maybe that's why it didn't bother me. But I also again, going back to what I did like with the heart and probably transitioning this, I really loved Sue Storm's portrayal. Yes. And I loved how strong she was.
Matt Kopfhamer:Absolutely. Lisa Kirby was fantastic.
Samantha Holt:She was amazing in all levels of the performance. And if anything, at the end of the movie, I was like, Fantastic Four. She's pretty fantastic. I'm kind of lacking more fantastical from the rest of these guys. Felt like she was carrying them and then saving the world.
Samantha Holt:Oh. And they
Matt Kopfhamer:were just like Always does.
Samantha Holt:Cheerleaders at the end. And if that's like the normal comic book is, then I'm like, cool. Okay. Then it definitely hit the mark because she just crushed it.
Matt Kopfhamer:And Sue is easily the most powerful of the four.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah.
Jagger May:Yeah. And Matt Shachman, if like, you can order this right now, $14. We're not sponsored. I just think you should read books. But, Matt Shachman read.
Jagger May:He wrote the He wrote the introduction of this. This was his big, inspiration. The fantastic force solve everything and, like, bring everything together. That that was Sue Storm 100% Sue Storm literally, like fantastic force saw everything tells Namor. I'm also queen of the oceans because I did a deal with these ancient Atlanteans.
Jagger May:Go fuck yourself, Namor. And, like like, that that is a 100% her. Like, she is the killer. Most of the
Matt Kopfhamer:time Yeah.
Jagger May:Yeah. Most of the time, Sam, like, you nailed it. Reid, a lot of times, is in his own head. He's just like, well, I've gotta calculate and blah blah blah. And then Sue's just like, Jesus fucking Christ.
Jagger May:And just like Oh,
Matt Kopfhamer:she just does shit.
Samantha Holt:That's why she's also the speaker at, like, the UN, and she's going and making all these deals. She is the face of them because she's the one that's the most put together and knows how to bring people together. She also saw the riot starting up outside of their building was like, I'm just gonna go out there and talk to them and be real. And that was really moving too because she took that into into her own hands. Because the guys, they were like, well, the hell do we do?
Samantha Holt:And I really liked that because it's the very opposite of what most action films and comic book movies and even all of this does is you have the woman going to the guys saying, well, what do we do now? And you have the guys here all just not knowing what to do. And instead of turning to her, she just steps up and just goes and does the thing and makes the move and just she was amazing. I loved it.
Jagger May:She's a perfect casting.
Alfredo Brown:I've loved
Jagger May:her since the crown. Yeah. All four women watching this Same. Who have seen The Crown too. This was, like, like, we we knew it.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:No. Yeah. Vanessa Kirby's here. The Sue Storm, I I can we also just compare this portrayal to the other rel like, truly garbage portrayals of Sue Storm that we've had? They, like, made her it bridges the the most Yeah.
Alfredo Brown:We don't need Jess Galvis.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I like Jess Galvis. Here. The character
Alfredo Brown:Galvis is sitting at home doing the 50ยข. What are saying?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:No. You didn't
Jagger May:you didn't like the scenes or
Matt Kopfhamer:she had to get completely naked when she used her powers? Come on, Vignesh.
Alfredo Brown:That's what I'm saying.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:That stuff like
Matt Kopfhamer:Formative scene for a teenage Matt.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:So Well, those were the jokes that they did back then. Whereas here, you have Reed Richards, the alleged most intelligent man on the world in the world. But then you see Vanessa Kirby's portrayal of Sue Storm, and she's clearly the most, like, emotionally intelligent person on the planet. Right? They didn't nerf her.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:It's her powers were great. Her geopolitical maneuvering was great. She solves the problem, with, Elder, the mole man guy, and getting everyone safe. I can't you know, she the fact that if you take it on its own, when you see her going down and talking to people with Franklin, it sounds like the dumbest idea in the world. You're like, this is so silly.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Why would you do this? And then the fact that she convinces everyone also sounds really silly, but they laid bread crumbs throughout everywhere to show the effect, the power, her gravitas, her persona, who she is to that world. Right? She is the person who's done everything. But at the same time, they didn't just make her this, like, goody two shoes mom savior of the world.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I really loved that little line where she goes, kill her, Johnny. Right? Like, to to the Silver Surfer when they're trying to escape from Galactus' ship. It gave me gave me a hint of Malice. Anyone besides Jagger here?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Feel that? Think about Malice there?
Samantha Holt:That's the mama bear right there.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I loved it. I was
Samantha Holt:like Go and solve the problem. Get it.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:And if you haven't read the Malice comics and stuff, like, that's the
Alfredo Brown:I like that. I mean, you've seen the
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Sue Storm.
Alfredo Brown:You've seen the Malice tree. Skin going around. Right? Yeah. They showed it they showed it Wait.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I haven't seen it.
Matt Kopfhamer:For Marvel Marvel rivals. Oh, boy.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. Marvel rivals has a malice skin for a character and they showed it to yeah. Pedro and It's NSFW, dawg.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Okay. Yeah. I didn't know. I so, you know, I I'll just quickly say this to you. I didn't watch any of the trailers.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:The only trailer I saw for this movie was when I was went to go watch Superman. As you all know, I don't really watch trailers. And so for me, actually, the first thirty five minutes or so were actually kind of enjoyable even if it was a recap of the trailer.
Alfredo Brown:Jag, you're on mute, pal.
Jagger May:Though to kick it back to you, Alfredo, I think too, and again, referencing the comic book, I think maybe the studio went in there and says, we need to make it shorter, and we need to like, this is confusing because f four solve everything is confusing. Like, literally, there is several things happening all at once. So I can imagine Red Ghost is happening. We've got Moleman down here and then, oh, fuck, Galactus. And I imagine, like, the studio brain was just like, mm-mm.
Jagger May:Then they cut it out and it stripped a lot of the stuff that would have made this like a 10 to me.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Yeah. You know?
Alfredo Brown:They they did something there where they really showed how strong Reed's mind is for a moment where as you see all of the flying police cars going places, and he's like, yeah. I've tracked all of the all of the gangs and all of the crime activity, and that's being stopped. Like, it it almost shows like Reed can just stop it at any moment if he wants, but he's so preoccupied with other shit that he's like, this isn't really that important. And, like It's
Vignesh Doraiswamy:not worth it.
Alfredo Brown:That that, I think, was probably the best moment for Reed Richards for that character because it really showed the dichotomy of who he is, like, what he is forced to be and what he wants to be. And I get that because sometimes you can you can think you're making the right choices, but still question yourself a ton on this. We talked a lot about Reid. We talked a little bit about Sue here as well. I wanna, like, just go into these four characters right here.
Alfredo Brown:Out of these four, who do you think was the best all the way down from, like, top character to
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Sue Storm.
Alfredo Brown:Probably probably, you know, not so great.
Jagger May:The Storm siblings, to be honest. Like, I thought One and two. Yeah. I thought Johnny
Matt Kopfhamer:Sue, Johnny, Ben, and then Reed.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Yeah.
Matt Kopfhamer:Or Reed's
Vignesh Doraiswamy:a story
Alfredo Brown:for him.
Jagger May:Yeah. Johnny felt like Johnny too because he's just like, hey. I'm not dumb. And I do I do appreciate that. I love Chris Evans, but, again, that movie was very early February where everything was about fucking, you know, where
Alfredo Brown:Every every male character was Ryan Reynolds, like, at that point. Like, they were always Van Wilder. Yeah. That's that's what I'm
Jagger May:Hey. I'm Quippy. You wanna bang? Yeah. That's it.
Jagger May:Like, I like, everyone.
Samantha Holt:But you never meet them out in the wild.
Matt Kopfhamer:I did I did like that they gave Johnny something to do with the the end plot where he wasn't just, you know, the flame on flamboyant guy. He was actually integral to turning turning Charleball to an ally. And I think that was really well done how they pace that throughout the movie where he basically finds the power within, not just the power of his, you know, you know, flaming ability.
Samantha Holt:Yeah. I agree. I think that ranking works for
Matt Kopfhamer:most I don't know how to phrase that with fire building.
Jagger May:Tried to keep together, man. I was shocked. Was like, just in short. I
Matt Kopfhamer:said it, and I was like, that's that's not weird. But
Jagger May:Sorry, Sam. I had to I tried to keep
Samantha Holt:Y'all are 12.
Jagger May:I cracked.
Alfredo Brown:You had so many other words you could have chosen.
Matt Kopfhamer:Flame on. There you go. That one.
Alfredo Brown:I I so, yeah, I I agree here that I think Sue Storm was the heart and soul of this movie. I think Johnny was every time he was on screen, he he stole the screen, especially when he was on with Pedro. I kinda wish we got more Ben Grimm and more of the thing. And I felt like that's mostly what got cut because it did seem like there was a bit of his character arc that happens that you don't really get to know or get to see. And I thought that Evan Mas Bakroc, like, did a great job with that.
Alfredo Brown:Almost felt perfect. Not almost. He felt perfect for this, especially because of his experience with the bear and, like, no no free ads. But those of you who have not watched the bear over on Hulu, it's a fantastic show. And you sort of get the Reed Richards is a bit like Carmen Brazzado, where he's this, like, perfectionist that questions everything he does, but it's, like, not good with people.
Alfredo Brown:And, like, people don't like working with him, but they kinda do it because of family. Like, I just finished watching the latest season of the bear, and it was the exact same thing. And it was just a perfect casting for him as the thing. It felt like we really we went three for four on this casting of just perfect castings all the way through. Could we have gotten more story from each of them?
Alfredo Brown:Yes. And it's it's weird to say, like, I don't know what the missing ingredient was with Reid because Pedro didn't act it poorly. The character was not written necessarily poorly.
Jagger May:There's not a I just it was written flat.
Matt Kopfhamer:It was written flat.
Jagger May:Yeah. He he was written flat, and he didn't have room. There was
Matt Kopfhamer:no He didn't have an art.
Jagger May:Stretch. He like you said, the only time he had to do Reed shit, he's just like, oh, yeah. I just solved the gang crisis. And then just, like, kinda walks off. You know, like, no time.
Samantha Holt:I feel like if you'd just given him if we'd gotten maybe ten more minutes out of the movie, fifteen more minutes, there's other ways that you could have extended scenes that you guys wouldn't have felt like, you know, wanting.
Matt Kopfhamer:I wish we had seen him I wish we had seen him, like, tinkering more. That's something Like, in the whenever whenever they're not in an action scene, Reed is in his fucking lab doing some something. He's doing some sort of experiment. He's building something. And it felt like we got a little
Vignesh Doraiswamy:if of I'm being real.
Matt Kopfhamer:We Yeah. We got a little bit of that with the crib, but I felt like the rest of the the rest of the movie, he's just talking.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I felt like bridge.
Alfredo Brown:I felt like I felt like he had a a piece of chalk in his hand, like, for 75% of the movie. Like, that that's what they that was the direction they went with Reed. And I'm almost saying that, like, I kinda wanna see the asshole leader of the Fantastic Four that we got to see for a brief moment when Mole Man shows up. And Moleman walks in with his swinging dick. He's like, turn down the lights.
Alfredo Brown:I want an apology from this guy. And, like, Reed gets upset. Almost like Yeah. That was really one of the few times we got to see emotion out of him that wasn't I I just think it was a it was a square peg round hole for this character where it was the character itself was a bit confusing and, like, we I I at least I struggled to to to latch onto him throughout the
Samantha Holt:Actually, wanna go back to what you just said, Koff, to kind of tie into what you just said, Alfredo. I think if you had a little bit more time to those tinkering scenes specifically, and I know you're saying he had chalk in his hand. And then all of a sudden, we had the little model for, you know, moving the egg from this side of the lab to this side. But what you got from previous Marvel movies like Iron Man with Tony Stark being really brilliant, incredible scientist, he watched him go through trial and error with making, like, the Iron Man suit. And you actually saw him in the lab working.
Samantha Holt:He was doing calculations. And, yes, he had, you know, different technology than you see in this film. But that gap in understanding going from a chalkboard to show sixties to then having this very futuristic element, there wasn't a bridging of the gap between those two things. And if you had a little bit more time to explain the a b c rather than just a to c, it probably would have given you more of that level of intelligence and nerd dom that you wanted from his character.
Alfredo Brown:You you know what the difference is, I think, is that through Tony Stark's tinkering is you get to see his personality, even from the way he talks to Jarvis to the way that he'll talk to Yinsen in the cave, like, the way he the way he does, like, just everything. You see the personality. And I I don't think I know that Reid is obviously very different from Tony Stark, but I don't think we got to see enough of the personality through what he was doing. And I I do think that was intentional. I think that was intentional because of the the the new equation of fatherhood being involved in this, which
Matt Kopfhamer:It also
Alfredo Brown:I think it would've in many ways purposely nerfed him.
Matt Kopfhamer:It also would've given them more opportunity to show off his powers. Like, he could have been casually using his stretching ability in the lab more to show how he utilizes it, not just in a combat situation, but in his everyday life. Yeah. Because that's something, again, in the comics, he just in
Jagger May:the house.
Matt Kopfhamer:He used it at the. A little bit, but
Jagger May:he can't
Vignesh Doraiswamy:the just house. We saw that in the ship. We saw that putting a seat belt on, which trust me, dude.
Alfredo Brown:Feels Our
Vignesh Doraiswamy:seat bases are tough.
Matt Kopfhamer:Feels like it was just too little. Like, they needed to dial up just a couple more notches, and it would've to me, it would've just been it would've fixed a lot of these problems that we're having with this character, I feel like. Because it just felt like we got half of Reed instead of the full Reed Richards.
Alfredo Brown:What about everything else in this? The sixties aesthetic, the alternate world.
Matt Kopfhamer:It was fine
Vignesh Doraiswamy:with
Alfredo Brown:stuff work for you guys? Because I was like, I I I'll agree. I was fine with it. I think what ended up happening with me is we kinda knew the beginning of this because we know their origin. We got so much of the trailer that gave us the beginning of the movie.
Alfredo Brown:We already know because of Thunderbolts, they end up in this other universe. And I think where this movie ends up being a little flat for me is they're in a world I don't care about. We don't we haven't spent enough time with the characters. And then the crux of it ends up being, like, the MacGuffin is a baby that I don't really care about, but I I know I understand I should. Right?
Alfredo Brown:Like, and I'm I'm not trying to say that I don't care about the movie, but, like, the I think that's the reason that a lot of these things fall flat. It's like, you know that they're not long for this world. They're going to end up somewhere else, but we know they live. I I know that's the case with so many superhero movies, but I think that's what ended up happening for me is, like, I kinda got there. I was like, okay.
Alfredo Brown:Entertain me while I'm here because I kinda know where this is all going.
Matt Kopfhamer:The stakes didn't feel like they mattered.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah.
Jagger May:And I agree with you. I really really wanna Like, to me, the aesthetic meant nothing. It was a filter. You could have made this in the eighties. You could have made this in the sixties.
Jagger May:You could have made it on 06/16, and it wouldn't have mattered too much for me. And I'm not and when I say, like, a gimmick or a filter, it it it didn't negate it for me either. You know? Like, it didn't change anything. I just, to me, I think they needed to set something up to explain why the Phantax of Four did fuck all with Thanos.
Jagger May:You know? So, like, I get why they did it, and they had to make and they had to establish that it's a different six ones or a different Earth somehow, and this is the one way to, like, to me, it's like movie magic to especially when you have a young audience to let them know that this is a different world. You know? And I'm willing to accept that.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:And and with Jagger, except I think I'm willing to accept it a lot more. I think, you know, Matt Shachman, WandaVision guy. Right? Like, he knows how to create an aesthetic. And it's okay for
Jagger May:It's always sunny.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Culture. Right? This is a different movie. It's, yeah, it's a different movie for a different you know, the people who grew up watching Marvel movies are much older now. The kids these days are different ages.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Look. They still gotta sell their toys. I was at Target yesterday. They got their toys out there right next to Superman. Better looking toys than the Superman toys for what it's worth.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:But I thought it was totally fine. I actually really loved this retro futuristic vibe. At first, I was like, wait. Yeah. We got spaceships, and then we have car you know, cathode ray tube televisions, but I think that's okay.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I really liked I think that's what made it seem like, okay, this is not my world. This is a completely different Earth. It may have been their nineteen sixties. It may have been their February, and some things changed and some things didn't. I think it really actually made it feel like it was different.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Yes. The stakes feel a little less when we realize that these guys are gonna end up in 06/16 eventually, but I still enjoyed it. I liked a lot of the the way they did their breadcrumbs and stuff. Right? Like, we haven't talked much about Victor Von Doom or Latveria and how they, like, clearly show that
Jagger May:Not a real country.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Part of the UN or whatever being empty. What's up?
Jagger May:Latveria is not a real country for some of us who may not know.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Yeah. Yeah. Sure. But, you know, I I think they did a
Matt Kopfhamer:Only in
Alfredo Brown:her heart.
Matt Kopfhamer:Good job.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I really enjoyed the aesthetic. I think this is, like, gonna get noms for, like, costume design, set design type stuff. I thought the production was incredibly well done as it should for, like, a multimillion budget movie. But I don't actually think that it hurt in any way of mine.
Alfredo Brown:No. I I don't think the aesthetic
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Not the CGI baby.
Alfredo Brown:I I don't think the aesthetic hurt the film at all. I don't I I I do like that it was a self contained story. I think that's where the the emotion missed out because we've been attached to you said it's 37 movies. We have been attached to the other 36 movies that now you get to number 37, and you're like, oh, this is a new strand. Kinda like when you're watching Loki and they do an episode that's in a brand new timeline.
Alfredo Brown:We're like, well, don't really give a fuck about that timeline. Well, let's go back, you know. So I think that's where it was. The aesthetic, I think, was beautiful. Koff, you were gonna talk about the aesthetic of these villains because I think Galactus and Silver Surfer, they fucking nailed those.
Matt Kopfhamer:Oh my god. They looked amazing. I mean, just the details in Galactus's suit was incredible. How how I love the full reveal when he gets out of his drone, and he like, the the cords are popping out of his back and he's, like, fully stepping into like, alright. I I guess I gotta deal with this shit now.
Matt Kopfhamer:Like, that was
Alfredo Brown:just myself.
Matt Kopfhamer:Yeah. It was just a fantastic way to show the details versus what we got back in the, you know, the mid aughts with a fucking giant fart cloud in the sky. So gladly actually cloud.
Alfredo Brown:The guy about that.
Jagger May:A sun cloud. Oh.
Matt Kopfhamer:It was a Hoover.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:It was
Matt Kopfhamer:a guy Hoover with teeth.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:One more time.
Matt Kopfhamer:One more
Jagger May:time. Let's clip it. Clip clip that. Clip that. Nope.
Matt Kopfhamer:No. So the fact that they actually were like, let's go comic accurate and and then it just they nailed it. They went above and beyond my expectation for it. And then the way they made Silver Surfer look, the way they were to distinguish the details in her eyeball versus her face versus her hair and having that all look distinct, I thought was fantastic. So, you know, I I can't give enough props to the design department for nailing those looks.
Jagger May:And I kinda wanna talk about the silver surfer because, like, a lot of people are like, well, that's just like, woah. No. Again, guys, this is this universe
Matt Kopfhamer:is in the comics.
Jagger May:Yeah. It's in the comics. This is this universe's silver surfer. And all this does is get me excited for six one six because, like, if we do get Norn rad, it's gonna look fucking dope. It's like, basically where I'm at here.
Jagger May:Like, like, I'm not worried about how that's gonna look, and I'm just ready for that because I do think that they're making an l an elseworld in a sense is pretty smart because it keeps them flexible to do other things in the future. You know? Yep.
Alfredo Brown:So this being an origin story that really didn't have too much origin. Right? It's let's just call it, like, a first film in the line of of these superheroes from Marvel. Where would you rank this amongst a bunch of the other ones? Because I think we've got some great first films in Marvel, Iron Man, Guardians, Black Panther.
Alfredo Brown:I I you know, there there's the tiers to it. Right? Does this fall in that, Iron Man Guardians Black Panther tier, or is this in maybe the Ant Man, Doctor Strange tier? Where where where does this fall for you guys? Who wants to go first?
Jagger May:I'll go first
Vignesh Doraiswamy:because I'll be positive. Can't Oh, let's go ahead, Jagger. You can be positive. No. Jagger's going positive.
Alfredo Brown:I'm excited for Jagger to be positive.
Jagger May:This is big day. When you actually put this list here, I think it might be two for me because I genuinely think Guardians of the Galaxy is the number one origin, just best movie. I think Iron Man is number two or three. I think Iron Man's a little bit like, it was a big deal on here, but, like, Obadiah is kind of a shitty villain in my opinion. I think this might be two, to be honest.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I'm with Jagger. This isn't that top tier for me. It's precisely because it's not a traditional origin movie. It's sort of like what Superman just did. Right?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Like, Kevin Feige talked about how he loved that they did that. I just love that the origin was sort of given to us in universe
Jagger May:Five minutes.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Through a little story. Yes. Yes. That's a little exposition heavy, and it's a little you know, it violates the the show don't tell sort of rules. But, like, this isn't made for cinephiles.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Right? This is, like, made for people who wanna have a good time, and I think that was a good way to do it. And I really love that we didn't get yet another like, I didn't need to see them go get blasted with cosmic rays again. But I got a lot more world building, and I got to see this universe through a TV show and through a cartoon that's in their universe. So you guys talked earlier about, like, maybe not caring as much, but I actually cared a lot more about 08/28 than I thought I would because they built a whole universe of people that show that they're very different from us, but essentially, they're still the same as us.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:This is though it's not an origin movie, I think it's one of my favorite, like, first steps sort of movie.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. I see what you did there.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Thank you. I'll pray. I'll just hope that someone will notice.
Matt Kopfhamer:You said
Alfredo Brown:the thing? Yeah. The wink at the camera didn't give anything away. Sam, what were
Samantha Holt:you saying? I definitely wanna put it in, like, the top five for me as well of original MCU movies. Again, kind of what Vic just said too, and I politely disagree with what you guys said before about this timeline not caring about it. I felt like I did care about this more because this is a world where these kids and these people have grown up with Fantastic Four. And this goes back to that comic book era of, you know, the kids wanna dress up like their heroes and they want to watch TV shows about their heroes.
Samantha Holt:And it's all within that one world. I don't think that it would have been as successful to do that if it was in our, you know, the normal timeline that we're used to. But this bubble universe that kinda creates, because it's a separate timeline, I can forgive that more. And it's a little bit more wholesome in my opinion that they're growing up with this level of hero and this level of dependability. The heroes are involved in the government, involved in politics, and it's all just a norm.
Samantha Holt:And that makes it its own special thing for me. So, yeah, I wanna definitely put it in top five. I kind of wanna put it around three for me in terms of original origin MCU movies.
Jagger May:We're all top three, but for different reasons, which is cool.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. I think Earth eight two eight is a it's a snow globe.
Samantha Holt:Yeah.
Alfredo Brown:It's a snow globe. Like, it's pretty to look at. You wanna protect it. It's delicate. It's cute, but it's, like, it's self contained.
Alfredo Brown:But, like, once I walk away from that snow globe, like, I don't really care because I'm not looking at it anymore.
Jagger May:That's a good analogy.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. I'm just Where it's like when I'm where where it's like when I'm looking at Earth six one six, like, that feels like a full topographical map, like, map. I'm, like, looking at a gigantic
Vignesh Doraiswamy:36 snow globes to make that map.
Alfredo Brown:Know, man. It's gonna take time. Not saying that this one snow globe needs to be, like, better than the other one. I'm saying it's hard to care about that snow globe when you're not looking at it is is what I'm saying. And, like, that's why it's just, like, it it felt hard to win me over in that moment.
Alfredo Brown:That that's it.
Samantha Holt:But it's also just nice to visit.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Feel the opposite only because, like, That's
Samantha Holt:what snow globes are for in terms of travel. Like, you used to collect them because you went to different places. And that's what these movies do is you go and visit different places, and you now have a new affinity for somewhere that you didn't realize, you know, you could find a connection to. So I feel like it also creates different levels of connecting with others. Like, when I get on a plane and I go somewhere else, I'm like, oh, there's people here too.
Samantha Holt:Yes. There's people everywhere. So just finding that other way to connect us together, I thought was pretty beautiful.
Jagger May:Mhmm.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I'm leaning towards six seventy.
Jagger May:There's some sunshine through there.
Matt Kopfhamer:Dude, know,
Alfredo Brown:so the six one
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I'm actually can I say this? I'm a little bummed that we're gonna leave 828 and go to 616. 616 is a giant cluster of just way too many superheroes and things that they just don't, like, talk about. Right? Like, Eternals happened.
Matt Kopfhamer:Don't worry.
Alfredo Brown:Right. We'll get back to world.
Matt Kopfhamer:It'll be fine. They'll reset everything.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Eventually, but, like, it Eternals happened. It was a not a great movie, but, like, all the stuff that happened around Eternals, all the stuff that was there, like, they all existed
Matt Kopfhamer:Captain America.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Six one six years.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. There
Vignesh Doraiswamy:and so it just wasn't
Alfredo Brown:they're like, now we have Adamantium, by the way.
Jagger May:Which they already should have had. But, anyway, it's like, it's
Vignesh Doraiswamy:just Exactly. And so this gives us a new opportunity to, like, maybe not have so many, what feels like continuity errors. I love that this was a world for the Fantastic Four, by the Fantastic Four. And they were the ones you grew up with. Like, I I echoing just what Sam said, I think that I actually enjoy this more because I didn't have to worry about six one six.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I didn't have to worry about, wait, this doesn't make sense because, like, x y z happened in this movie. And I think it gives me a lot more time. I'm kinda bummed that we're gonna go back to six one six.
Matt Kopfhamer:It was kinda in the back of my head the whole time. I was like, how is it how is this gonna connect to 616? Because we already saw in Thunderbolts that they're they're gonna make their way there.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I know.
Matt Kopfhamer:So the whole movie, I'm like, alright. When's the moment? When's the moment? It didn't happen.
Alfredo Brown:That's that's a good jumping off point. That's a good jumping off point then. It's like, how do we think this is going to connect to the greater MCU? Because I think this post credit scene or mid credit scene with with doom there, holding Franklin Richards. I think that's the jumping off point.
Alfredo Brown:I think, like, as as we we talked about earlier, I think that's it's doom takes Franklin, and our heroes need to find their way to this alternate universe. And that's how they show up. Because I fully expected this to be like Galactus wins. And the Fantastic Four just say, I thought they were gonna be like, alright. Fuck it.
Alfredo Brown:We gotta get out of here and protect our baby, and they just bounce to to, yeah, yeah, to a different universe.
Matt Kopfhamer:That that was waiting for Franklin. I was waiting for Franklin as a baby to just pop them into the other universe as a way yeah. As a way to save them from Galactus. But again, it didn't happen that way.
Jagger May:So Do we think Franklin builds battle worlds? Because he can.
Matt Kopfhamer:Think doom somehow siphons Franklin's power and then builds battle worlds. I think that's the route they're gonna go with.
Jagger May:And Or Doom steals
Matt Kopfhamer:Franklin, kidnaps him, does some time shenanigans, and, like, raises him as his own, and then convinces him to use his power for his own endgame.
Alfredo Brown:Jack, can you give people a quick bullet points, like, notes of Franklin's power here? So because that because we now have essentially the most powerful being in the Marvel Cinematic Universe.
Jagger May:Yeah. Franklin has alternate
Matt Kopfhamer:level mutant.
Jagger May:Yeah. He's a he's an Omega level mutant, and he can alter reality and even to a bigger sense than And Wanda this weird Taylor Swift Wanda people, I'm sorry, but, like, Franklin is just vastly more than Wanda is. Wanda changes this universe or the universe she's in. Franklin creates universes, and that's, like, the big thing. Franklin is essentially doctor Manhattan.
Jagger May:Like like, that's realistically, that's the least put it.
Matt Kopfhamer:Yeah. Yep. I mean Without the big swing of the
Alfredo Brown:mother life But his without even being able to speak.
Samantha Holt:Yeah. But his name is just Franklin?
Jagger May:Yeah. The like, they they looked at that baby.
Matt Kopfhamer:They looked
Jagger May:at all. God. Is the Frank Hey. It's Franklin.
Samantha Holt:No. I'm just Name of
Jagger May:the script.
Samantha Holt:Just to to be the dumb one to ask a dumb question. So, like, he's this all powerful being, but I but I don't know what his superhero name is. Is is he just Franklin? Like, I'm I don't know. Just that's it?
Alfredo Brown:Well, he Can we be real? He worked in sixties.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:He would
Matt Kopfhamer:have been named Franklin. I was gonna say he he goes by he goes by Powerhouse briefly. Even that Yeah.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I was gonna say Powerhouse?
Alfredo Brown:Most His name
Vignesh Doraiswamy:is Franklin Benjamin Storm, named after his, like, maternal grandfather or something and Ben for Ben Grimm. Yeah. If you wanna get real lore
Jagger May:at you. I I was trying to not to get there, but you went there.
Samantha Holt:I wanted to get there. I just I'm sorry. I can't I'm not familiar with him.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Asked for it. I had to go there.
Matt Kopfhamer:This just with the introduce with the introduction of Franklin, though, it just goes to show that, like, they should have fucking introduced the x men already. Like, we need the x men for Franklin's powers to make fucking sense
Jagger May:in this universe. No way I I Yeah. To use lore and to use, like, the lore master thing, this is where guys like me, where I'm like, I'm to me, I feel like I'm the guy who wants you to enjoy a good story. And then when these other people make decisions, when they bring in Franklin, I'm like, no. We're not ready yet.
Jagger May:Like like, why did you just bring God already? Like, we haven't even It's
Matt Kopfhamer:too soon. Yeah.
Alfredo Brown:Well, wait. Cough, why do you say they need to have the X Men? It's because you need to establish mutants because they they have done that. Yeah. Like, they they they did it they did it very I mean, they did it very subtly.
Alfredo Brown:They've established that that Kamala Khan is a mutant. They they did this at the end of the Marvels where they established that the mutants are are around.
Matt Kopfhamer:I get that. I get that. What I'm saying, though, is for a character as powerful as Franklin to really make sense in my mind, you need to have him have contemporaries so that you can compare him to. So you need other mutants to be like, yeah, these dudes are powerful. This guy can shoot, like, you know, force beams out of his eyeballs that punch you in the face.
Matt Kopfhamer:That's pretty cool.
Alfredo Brown:No? Yeah. They gave you four of the mutants.
Matt Kopfhamer:Yeah. This guy, Apocalypse, can basically change matter into whatever he wants on his body and has technological stuff. Now we have Franklin Richards coming in who is, like Jack said, literally god. He can create anything with the, like, the the thought. And so to have somebody that powerful come into the fold this early just feels like the the cart before the horse
Jagger May:in my It that yeah. The things that I get like, Jagger, you're so negative. I'm like, Yeah. You shouldn't bring in the most powerful weapon immediately. And I and I wanna admit to go back to this earlier.
Jagger May:I think big what you said and Sam, what you're feeling about 08/28. I just think the MCU needs a nuke, man. I just think we should have nuked the MCU and start all over with fantastic.
Alfredo Brown:They said it. Kevin Feige has said it. It's gonna be a reset of this whole universe. Secret Wars is gonna establish a brand new Marvel Cinematic Universe, which is going to be centered around the X Men. Like, this this has been said.
Alfredo Brown:It's not a theory. That's why, like, I'm I'm not too worried about where this is going. It's kind of a a much needed reset. I'm actually more worried about, like, how they handle Franklin Richards going forward. It's not Correct.
Alfredo Brown:It's I I'm not worried about, like, oh, I have the established mutants and all that other stuff. It's it's how do they handle him because he's gonna be so OP overpowered that you kinda need to almost explain where he's going to be for the next couple movies and, like, what what what's going on there. And that's where I I worry a little bit about them sort of dancing like a
Vignesh Doraiswamy:breadcrumbs for that. Right? I agree. They they could mess this up. They brought the most powerful character in, but they brought him as a child.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:He unintentionally brings his mom back to life. Mhmm. They do the little breadcrumbs where she talks about he's not us. He's more. So they establish that the four of us who got hit by Cosmic rays
Alfredo Brown:What we can
Vignesh Doraiswamy:do? Mutants of a variety. And then now we brought Doom in. So I think they've, like, really and we will watch this character both grow literally and figuratively. Right?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Like, he's so young. He's four years old or maybe four four four and a half years old. At that point, we see him with doom and reading storybooks. But even then, they've already shown us that he has read the entire Origin of Species by their universe's Charles Darwin as a four year old. So they are showing us sort of thing.
Alfredo Brown:Think he
Samantha Holt:could read.
Matt Kopfhamer:You haven't read any.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Yeah. So so I think
Alfredo Brown:I read the very hungry cattle do it. Last week. Mhmm.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:And you read that too.
Jagger May:Right? Another thing we need to set up too is that I'm worried about is, like, both Richards. There's two Richards kids that no one's talking about. And they're both they're both O P powerhouses. Yeah like like, it's like cool Franklin's just God.
Jagger May:Well, what's Valeria do? Oh she's now the smartest person in the world. She is smarter than Reed Richards by the time she's, like, eight years old. It's like, not even close. So, like like, we just gone so far that I'm just I I feel like we've got Goku's now and one punch man where, like, that whole concept is, like, we have these heroes that are just so strong that it come it becomes difficult for us to have good stories.
Jagger May:I mean, James Gunn had to nerf Superman.
Alfredo Brown:You know? Thank you for saying it. Thank you for saying it because I was gonna say, I think that's gonna be the biggest deciding factor between Marvel and DC going forward is that James Gunn has made it a point to say, hey. Superman is not as strong as we are used to him being because that's not as fun. And Marvel's actually going, man, we did a bunch of these not so strong characters, and you guys got bored.
Alfredo Brown:We're we're about to bring in some of the most powerful characters ever. And I I think it's gonna be that that's gonna be interesting to see how they handle that because you need to have a a lot of tact with those kind of characters.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:To be fair, they kinda took the smartest man in the world and made him not so smart. So maybe they are taking that in.
Matt Kopfhamer:Maybe they
Vignesh Doraiswamy:are taking that shirt. I love it.
Jagger May:Got he got me there. They they
Matt Kopfhamer:got their Nerf guns at the ready.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:There's a Nerf. They they nerfed his brain.
Alfredo Brown:So we got the news recently that, Kevin Feige and Marvel want to keep Robert Downey junior as doctor Doom going forward. You guys like that?
Jagger May:No. Almost logged off, like, out of reflex.
Matt Kopfhamer:Rage quit.
Samantha Holt:He's Iron Man, and that's it.
Jagger May:Yeah. It's thank you. Like, fact that Stan dog, isn't he, like,
Alfredo Brown:sixteen ninety?
Jagger May:So Chet Sidney's like, maybe this is too much. I want Robert Downey Jr. To do something else. Let's go get
Alfredo Brown:a Go do doctor Doolittle two. Yes.
Jagger May:No. Don't do it. Don't do that. I don't wanna do that, tomboy. That's
Vignesh Doraiswamy:just Give me Tropic Thunder two.
Jagger May:No. Yeah. No. Tropic Thunder two. Do that again.
Matt Kopfhamer:But this time, he plays an Asian character.
Jagger May:No. It's just that Nope.
Alfredo Brown:Call off. Don't get canceled right now.
Jagger May:Go get someone else to be doomed. Stop being safe. Like, that's our problem. Yeah. Robert Downey Junior is safe.
Jagger May:Yeah We watched the MCU. To me, their disrespect. Kevin Feige is like disrespecting himself. I watched Ironman because I loved Robert Downey Jr. For sure.
Jagger May:I loved Chris Evans. I love Chris Hemsworth. But you made a good story, dude. Like, I'm not saying that Robert Downey junior wouldn't have made that or someone else wouldn't have done as well as Robert Downey junior, but I don't think Robert Downey junior or Chris Evans or any of these actors for that matter wouldn't have done as well within the Infinity Saga if you didn't set up such a well cared story. Yeah.
Jagger May:Just make a just make a good story, dude, and then you can put again, like, Killian Murphy. Like, you could do all kinds of stuff with these actors. You don't have to just keep putting a quarter in the Robert Downey junior vending machine.
Samantha Holt:You know? Why not allow there's so many good actors out there. Why not allow us to fall in love with someone else? And, yes, I would much rather see RDJ do, like, you know, a new season of True Detective or, like, something else that would be much more fun to, like, watch him in.
Matt Kopfhamer:That'd be
Samantha Holt:That that would be really good in my opinion. I feel like that would give me because give me detective Robert Downey Junior. Give me some him in something else. Let him go chase more Oscars. Sherlock?
Samantha Holt:He deserves it. I mean, I think he's a fantastic actor, but, like, that
Matt Kopfhamer:Another Sherlock movie.
Samantha Holt:Sure. Fuck it. I don't care.
Jagger May:I actually love those movies. I don't care.
Alfredo Brown:But
Matt Kopfhamer:They're so good.
Samantha Holt:They're fine.
Matt Kopfhamer:They're so fun.
Samantha Holt:They're fine. Yeah. Just do more of them. They're absolutely fine. Allow someone else to be, you know, doctor doom and for us to fall, you know, for someone new.
Samantha Holt:Let it be new. If you're really going to new with the universe and just start over, start new. Don't bring us back with
Matt Kopfhamer:old Henry Cavill is doom.
Samantha Holt:Okay. Well, I love Henry Cavill and everything, so it's really hard to say.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:But But
Matt Kopfhamer:he'd be covered in a mask the whole time. So
Samantha Holt:But if I just snuggle
Jagger May:chest, though. Just bare
Vignesh Doraiswamy:chested doom. She knows that solo. She knows it well.
Samantha Holt:I know that solo. I know the shape of his body.
Alfredo Brown:Cocking the arms back and forth every time he's about to fight. Yeah.
Samantha Holt:Then shoulders.
Matt Kopfhamer:I've come for you, Reid.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Yeah. I mean
Matt Kopfhamer:Time to
Vignesh Doraiswamy:fuck. My my take is that I'm I'm disappointed. I'm disappointed because, you know, I like to try new things. Right? I might go to the restaurant and try the same thing every single time and that's okay.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:But, like, man, if you go to a restaurant and going out to eat, you wanna try some new things sometimes and there's a lot of great new things out there. So this just seems like you got an allergy and the only thing you can eat is, like, Robert Downey junior. So so
Samantha Holt:so it is
Vignesh Doraiswamy:what it is. I'm a little disappointed, but, you know, I think Kevin Feige has also shown us that him and his group, like, you know, they'll they take care in how they create and craft their stories and movies. And even if some have been misses, it's hard to have 37 straight hits. I I'm okay with it. I think it'll be okay.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I just don't want it to focus too heavily on the fact that he is doom. I I just want that to be, like, something to acknowledge and move over and just give me a good story. Don't spend too much time dwelling on that sort of stuff. If they do, I think it could misfire spectacularly.
Alfredo Brown:Well, guys, I think we've talked this movie to death. I think, we all agree we enjoyed it. We're at least very curious to see where the MCU is going to go. And, man, Doctor Doom, Franklin Richards, the Fantastic Four, I I hope I really hope they they keep this thing going in a very positive direction. Because if not, I don't know that, like, I'm fully back in on Marvel just yet.
Alfredo Brown:I think I'm just still sitting there with a little bit of hope. Is everyone kind of in the same spot, or are you guys just like, we're good? We're back?
Jagger May:I'm willing to text who all over there.
Alfredo Brown:Okay. Okay. Does that
Jagger May:Yeah. Yeah.
Matt Kopfhamer:Who's at this party?
Alfredo Brown:Explain Can that for the pigmented challenged audience?
Jagger May:I am willing to ask. I'm like, who's at this party? I'm intrigued. But if you say the wrong thing, I will say, yeah, man. I might want I might come through, but I won't.
Jagger May:I'm not coming through. You know what I'm saying?
Alfredo Brown:Okay. Okay.
Matt Kopfhamer:Young Avenger Thanks for explaining, Jagger.
Alfredo Brown:You going?
Jagger May:No, duh. Nope.
Alfredo Brown:I'm out. I'm not that reason. I'm out.
Jagger May:Wait. I'll just dump
Alfredo Brown:some stuff.
Matt Kopfhamer:Part of the Young Avengers is Hailee Steinfeld, so Jagger might be there.
Jagger May:Sinners is on max. Don't need it. Yeah.
Alfredo Brown:Alright. That's gonna that's gonna do it for us over here on, the video side on the YouTube side. Of course, if you haven't already, make sure you like this video. Comment down below with your thoughts. Subscribe to the channel.
Alfredo Brown:And, I got a fun story that I'm gonna be telling everybody over on the audio side. So if you are not not subscribed over to the podcast, go join us over there where if you don't wanna sit down in front of a video in front of YouTube for a little bit here, you can always listen to us on the audio side wherever you get your podcasts on Apple or Spotify. As always, wanna thank everybody for watching all the way through for myself, for Jag, for cough, for Vig, for sick Sammy, soon to be sunshine Sammy again. We thank you guys. We'll see you next time.
Alfredo Brown:Adios. Alright. Can I tell y'all the the story now of what happened, dude, please?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:The whole thing.
Samantha Holt:Yeah. Are you okay?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Were were
Jagger May:you with Gabby or you just solo? Was just No.
Alfredo Brown:I was I was alone.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:He went by himself.
Alfredo Brown:I was I was alone. And Gabby and I have never felt so scared for myself, like, just walking around as a white male in the world. And so Gabby and I are coming off of a long, like, eleven hour travel day coming from British Columbia, Canada, in in Vancouver all the way down to South Florida. Get there, land. We land in Fort Lauderdale.
Alfredo Brown:I gotta drive up to Port Saint Lucie, so that's an hour and a half drive. We get there, and I'm like, alright. Drop everybody off. I'm gonna go to the movies. I had a 9PM movie.
Alfredo Brown:Most movie theaters go a lot later. Like, they'll go, like, the hottest 11PM movies. Right? Like, this is an area that is not it's it's not that well developed. So a 9PM movie is the absolute latest they go.
Alfredo Brown:I get there. There's plenty of cars in the parking lot. I feel, you know, fine. This is normal. Right?
Alfredo Brown:I get there, and I see that a lot of the lights are off, which I'm like, okay. It's, you know, it's later in the day, whatever. They're just they're just getting ready to close-up. All of the doors to enter the theater are fucking locked. It's 09:04.
Alfredo Brown:Like, trailers are running for my 09:00 movie, but since, I guess, the last movie's at nine, they locked the door. There is not a single employee in sight, like, nowhere. I'm banging on the door because I'm not missing this. I I need to watch the movie for the pod. There's a family hanging out in the lobby just talking just talking, and I'm banging on the door, let it asking them to let me in.
Alfredo Brown:They look over and they do the, no. Like, not even a gesture. They looked at me like Frantic did
Vignesh Doraiswamy:you look?
Alfredo Brown:To look at a human. And that that's
Samantha Holt:why had asked them about Wait a second.
Alfredo Brown:Or No. Was like, wait a second. I was like, wait a second. I I really need to take a sec here and reconsider how I look. So I have, like, my my my plain outfit that I wear, which is just, black joggers, long sleeve, black, like, thin hoodie that I wear, and then my hair was, like, all fucked.
Alfredo Brown:So, like, I just looked really disheveled and then wearing, like, all black. It didn't it didn't look safe. And I I gotta be honest, I wouldn't have let me in either. But I'm there banging on this door. These people are not moving.
Alfredo Brown:It's about, like, six, seven minutes go by, and I'm I'm getting a little panicky that I'm just gonna miss this movie. Finally, they start to walk out. They push the exit door open. I slide through, and they're talking only Spanish. So I kinda give them a what the fuck in Spanish so they can hear me.
Alfredo Brown:And, they just they just did not give a single shit. I walked through nobody else in the movie theater. Like, not not a single employee, not another person watching a movie. I go into my my my theater, my my, like, individual theater. No one else in there.
Alfredo Brown:I sit down. Lights are all on. That's what I'm texting Jack, and I'm like, yo. I gotta go tell someone to turn the lights off. You let me know that beautiful piece of information is all programmed.
Alfredo Brown:I get there, watch the movie, whatever. It's it's it's a good movie. I leave. Not one fucking person is anywhere in this theater. Anywhere.
Alfredo Brown:I was worried that I was gonna be locked in. I walk out my car and I'm a I'm a I'll post this later. My car was the only one in the parking lot. There's not an employee. I have no idea what's going on at the AMC Port Saint Lucie, but it it gave me very much, like, knight at the museum vibes.
Alfredo Brown:Like, I thought shit was gonna come to life, or it could've gone, like, a very much the other way, like a horror movie.
Samantha Holt:Of a human trafficking.
Alfredo Brown:The oh, 100%. That's how it felt. Like, this was the creepiest fucking thing I have ever been involved in, having, like, just an empty movie theater, no people at night. I I never wanna do this again. I never wanna experience that again.
Alfredo Brown:But, also, it kinda let me know, I don't have to pay for tickets if I show up till till the last one. So maybe I do need to just overcome my fears.
Jagger May:Dude, as an ex movie theater early so
Vignesh Doraiswamy:you can be let in?
Jagger May:If I clocked out, you could've robbed that place. And I'd be like, you know, the chocolate covered almonds over there, you know, they really hit, dog. Get grab me a box.
Samantha Holt:Are we still recording?
Jagger May:Like, peep yeah. We are.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. We're
Vignesh Doraiswamy:recording. This is for
Jagger May:the audiobook. Is for the audiobooks. We give them a little something.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Oh, I
Jagger May:love it. Give them a little Just a little piece. Yeah. Just a little piece. A little nugget.
Samantha Holt:Oh. Well, glad you didn't die or get put into someone's van.
Alfredo Brown:I'm no. Yeah. I'm I'm pretty happy I didn't die or get put in a van.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Yeah. But now I know how to
Alfredo Brown:get free movie tickets, so that's fun.
Samantha Holt:There you go.
Alfredo Brown:If you guys ever wanna come down, you can join me for some free movies at the 9PM AMC showings.
Matt Kopfhamer:And a little bit of murder, baby.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. Coffee or mic is just gone. It's toast.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Shit. Ain't nobody. Yeah. You can't hear anything.
Jagger May:I wish you might have been trying to kidnap me. I'm dying for some conversation.
Samantha Holt:No one wants to be kidnapped. I need some excitement in my life. Was almost
Vignesh Doraiswamy:put in a
Jagger May:van, and it is not wanted.
Samantha Holt:No one wants me put in a van now.
Matt Kopfhamer:You know, somebody don't want me.
Alfredo Brown:Hold on. Hold on. Hold on.
Matt Kopfhamer:Wait. What
Alfredo Brown:happened? Sam, did you just say you were almost put in a van? What?
Matt Kopfhamer:When?
Alfredo Brown:Stories are going. What's going?
Samantha Holt:Years ago, I was running
Matt Kopfhamer:As a weed child.
Samantha Holt:No. It was it was after college. I was running by the beach. And, you know, there's this area of Long Beach. It's called The Peninsula.
Samantha Holt:And you run down it. It's beautiful and nice houses to a certain point. But then some of them are just, like, really old kind of shantiest houses. And it's a one way because Peninsula, you go down and you come back. And as you're running down and I'm running back, if you live in the neighborhood, you turn into wherever your home is.
Samantha Holt:Or if you're leaving the neighborhood, you just go out. There's no other purpose for driving down there. So there was this van that was driving slowly as I like, as it crossed me across the way, and then I saw it go down. And then it, as it was coming past, it slowed down and then it drove past. And was like, that's kinda weird.
Samantha Holt:And it did this so many times that I had to remember the license plate. And the last pass that it made, it was going so slow. And when I was looking at the car every time it came past, I was clocking. Okay. There's a driver.
Samantha Holt:There's someone in the back seat. There's no one in the front passenger seat. And I could tell when they were slowing, I was gonna get grabbed, basically, because there was someone right there. So I timed it with a stop sign, and I ran in front of an oncoming car and ran away from them to almost cause that van to go into an accident. And then I just sprinted home, and I was like, I don't think I should run alone anymore.
Jagger May:Fucked up. Absolutely not. That's that that's not even that's just scary.
Samantha Holt:Yeah. Being a girl is scary.
Jagger May:That's just scary.
Matt Kopfhamer:You almost got a free trip to Epstein Island, though. I mean No.
Jagger May:Cough? Nope. Alright. No. Stop.
Samantha Holt:That's and that's how this audio episode should end. Thanks, Cough.
Jagger May:Yeah. Love you, guys. We'll see you next week on Alright. Cough sticks his foot in his mouth.
Samantha Holt:Stranger danger people. It's real.