On today's episode of Unbinged, we're giving you everything you need to know before watching the Black Mirror season seven episode into infinity. This is the first sequel episode that Black Mirror has ever done. We're gonna give you a rapid recap of season four episode one titled USS Callister. That was the first episode. We're gonna discuss everything we know so far about this upcoming episode into infinity and give you our theories and answer some of the biggest questions that we have before the episode airs on Netflix.
Alfredo Brown:All that and more on an all new episode of Unvenged starting now.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Folks, we are gonna spoil everything about USS Callister, maybe even a little bit about what we already know about the the sequel. And because this is in a shared universe, we're probably gonna talk a little bit about some of those other Black Mirror episodes like White Christmas and Hang the DJ and the entire history of you and other stuff that may play into this a little bit. So make sure you're up to date on everything before you watch this episode.
Jagger May:USS Callister centers around a genius coder and company cash cow, Robert Daly. Quiet, meek, and albeit underappreciated, he vents his frustrations in a unique Star Trek like mod of the very game he developed, Infinity. I'm sure we all know the type. Anyway, of course, this isn't the average activity of an avid gamer. Infinity uses DNA to import the user's consciousness into the game.
Jagger May:However, Daily steals the DNA of his coworkers to create sick little severance innies for him to unleash his incel energy upon. Enter Nanette Cole, a new employee who expresses interest in Robert, and then Robert steals her DNA and inputs it into the game. Naturally, she's not so cool with that even as a digital clone because gross, your Audi had coffee with a psychopathic insult, and then leads a rebellion that leaves Robert brain dead and trapped in his own mod while they escape to live in the real Infinity game, which sets us up for the sequel episode USS Callister Into Infinity.
Alfredo Brown:So, guys, what we know so far about the episode Into Infinity, it's gonna premiere 04/10/2025. It's an hour and a half runtime. It's gonna kick off the Black Mirror season seven. It's our first true sequel that we've had in the show's history. I wanna ask you guys this, Vig.
Alfredo Brown:You're back for the first time in quite some time since severance, basically. I wanna ask you, what made USS Callister such a success for Black Mirror? Because when I was explaining this episode to my wife, I had to tell her, I think it's my favorite episode of Black Mirror. It was just so eye catching for me.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I mean, I could go on and on about all the different reasons why, but, like, this thing won Emmys. Again, it's visually stunning. The writing is crisp. There's tie ins to other episodes in the shared universe, like San Junipero, The Entire History of You Maybe, White Christmas. They, like, have little breadcrumbs that tied into the shared universe, and we really like that.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Charlie Burger does a really good job of taking inspiration and paying homage to other things like Star Trek, the the Twilight Zone. It's a good life episode. And even with Star Trek, like, there's, like, stuff that really references Peaksville and Charlie x, which is something like, you know, if you're watching WandaVision, you you appreciate that too. They just did a really good job, and it kinda maybe ended on an optimistic vibe. I don't know that I buy that.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:A lot of people love it because they're like, it wasn't like everything else in Black Mirror. It wasn't so sad and depressing. The good guys won. I don't know that they did. We can talk about that later, but I kinda liked it.
Alfredo Brown:They did one thing. That now.
Matt Kopfhamer:Yeah. The one thing you forgot, Vic, was the acting. I mean, god, we had some heavy hitters in this episode just crush it with personal interpersonal dialogue, but also some monologues. The Jimmy Simpson monologue about Tommy getting shot out of an airlock and how the skin turned like a porcelain doll, like, that was, ugh, gut wrenching. So I think that's why it's so successful.
Matt Kopfhamer:It's just the the character work by some of these just heavy hitter actors like Chris Mulati and Jimmy Simpson and, Jesse Plemons as Robert Daly. I mean, that to me is what was so captivating besides the aesthetic, besides the storyline, was just those character interactions.
Jagger May:Billy Magnusson is like I I would say he's I wouldn't say he's a heavy hitter, but he's a hitter. And they had him hit as a throwaway character. Yeah. Permanently underused in this one. Yeah.
Jagger May:Mhmm. Exactly. Like, I love Billy Magnuson and everything that he's in, and he was just, like, happy to be there. You know?
Alfredo Brown:He had, like, the one moment where he's he's asking the captain. He's like, I've been a good nemesis, haven't I?
Jagger May:Mhmm.
Alfredo Brown:Go ahead and end it. And, like, you actually feel for him. And just like the in the the brief moment. I think you're yeah. It's alright.
Alfredo Brown:Every single actor in this had a really good I mean, everyone almost think almost everyone had a monologue at some point where they were quite good. I mean, Jesse Plemons, I'll never not see him as Landry from Friday Night Lights, or I'll never not hear the free to like, how could that possibly be profitable for Frito Lay? If you haven't watched game night, go check that out. But this is like, this opened up a dark side to Jesse Plemons that I thought was so cool to see. And I think it makes you even start to ask other stuff where you feel bad.
Alfredo Brown:I think we, like, we memify people like this where we've even started to call them incels and, like, we there's I mean, to an extent, there's really bullying in the real world, but I'm not I'm I'm not caping for, Robert Daley here who's a crazy person. But I think it was an interesting way to take a look at a character who had been mistreated and misunderstood most of his life and what that led to. Because I don't know that we normally think about that. I think we often think of, like, the school shooter thing or we think about, how it affects people in the real world. This is the first time we actually had a look at ramifications where you're actually asking, do these characters have souls?
Alfredo Brown:Does it matter? And, I mean, it came out around was that just around the same time as Severance, guys? I don't remember.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Nah. It's gotta be older. It's gotta be older.
Matt Kopfhamer:It was way before. Yeah. And and what I liked is one of the themes I think, and I may be jumping ahead, that they're gonna explore, and they've touched it in other episodes, is are these digital copies actually real sentient beings? Do they deserve the rights that a flesh and blood person would? Because it made me remind it reminded me of White Christmas where these digital assistants are essentially digital slaves to the real I mean, using severance terminology, Audis.
Matt Kopfhamer:So where does that line exist and where will this show take that question? I think that's gonna be an exploration for this episode. That's gonna be really captivating to me at least.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:No. I think that's where they're going with this. And I I am really excited. See, sorry, Jagger. I'll let you go in a sec too.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:But, you know, they are now living, so to speak, right, these sentient clones in a world where they can die. It's not like it was in the previous world. They are like and who knows? This game probably has micro transactions. Like, how are they gonna get money when they're playing with real life people?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:It it is tough. Like, know, don't know that
Alfredo Brown:What character asks are we trading?
Jagger May:Yeah. I gonna say.
Alfredo Brown:Right?
Jagger May:Yeah. I was
Vignesh Doraiswamy:say yeah. How's Aaron Paul? Do we don't know that he recognizes that these are maybe, like, real life NPCs, so to speak. So it's kind of I think that's what they explore. So I think, yes, they've they've escaped into this wild new world, and I think she's gonna struggle.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Kristen Milliade, that is struggle to be a captain for this new crew. And I think it's really it's gonna be fun to see how they take it while still exploring some of those philosophical themes. Like, what does it mean to be human is, like, the most commonly explored theme, right, in across all sorts of science fiction. So I'm excited to see what they do there.
Jagger May:One thing that we haven't talked about is I'm curious to see if we get a parallel to Westworld because essentially, that's what we have now. You have all these people who go and visit a game because there's not real life consequences, but there's someone who's sentient and everything that happens to them, even though they're an NPC, they are I mean, they have a life and it matters to them. And, like, what's crazy is, like, I think USS Calcounsel is, like, a top five episode, but it's not my favorite just because I don't feel the moral dilemmas as some of the other ones. And, Alfredo, you always joke. We always joke how different we are.
Jagger May:And I'm like, oh, like, this episode isn't sad enough for me to love. You know?
Alfredo Brown:There was nobody fucking a pig in this episode.
Matt Kopfhamer:No trauma.
Alfredo Brown:Thumbs down, Netflix.
Jagger May:Yeah. Exactly. That's like I was just like like like, Charlie Brooker fell off. No kidding. This
Matt Kopfhamer:episode's too soft.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:But, you know, there there were some nice things about this episode. Going back to your first question that just came to mind, Alfredo, like, why did we really like this as well? Think they did a good job subverting some of those tropes that you talk about. We are used to seeing the poor misunderstood character be the good guy. Right?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Revealed that he's the bad guy was, I thought, done pretty well. And I really like how they they changed a lot of what you thought was gonna happen. I mean, the the twist was probably pretty predictable, but still, I think they did a really good job. And to go back to Cough, I didn't forget the acting. I'm really glad you brought it.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:The acting was incredible, but nothing can make up for really bad, crisp writing, and there's just so much attention to detail. And the writing, I think, was spectacular with really, really phenomenal payoffs, which is why I'm really excited to see how they explored this. And Jagger brought up Westworld, and we've talked about severance. The big difference here, though, is that these guys aren't severed. Right?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:These digital clones remember their outside life. And that is a kind of trauma maybe that we haven't really explored in in any of these other shows or maybe we have. I don't know. Is there any other show that talks about the digital clone remembering their outside world and life? Maybe besides, like, White Christmas?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Yeah. What you got?
Alfredo Brown:For you, and it's not digital clones. It's not Black Mirror. And Jagger is gonna go, what the fuck when I say it?
Matt Kopfhamer:To tell
Alfredo Brown:This is Toy Story. Nope.
Jagger May:But you're close.
Alfredo Brown:It's Toy Story. Because these are essentially Robert Daly's playthings that they are sentient. They do have feelings. They do have an understanding of everything that's going on, but the people around them don't know that they are alive. To me, like, that's actually what this started to feel like more than Severance or WandaVision or any of these other stories that we've seen.
Alfredo Brown:It feels a lot like Toy Story and dog, I don't know about you guys, but Toy Story three. Spoilers, by the way, when they're about to go into the incinerator. Oh. Tears.
Jagger May:Let's actually talk about, like and I guess we can go to the the, like, the ending of it because Yeah. Really, let's talk about what could be the incinerator. You know? Like, now they've they've gone from like, they had the warp hole thing that and that's just the game conceptualizing a patch update. Mhmm.
Jagger May:And this gives them access to being like an off board modded game, which I'm sure we have plenty of gamers who understand that. Then you can go into the real game. I mean, there's really nothing else to explain on that is because we've talked about it. They're up in the world. What happens if there's another patch, and they are not part of the actual original game?
Jagger May:Isn't it the same concept all over again where they're going to get wiped?
Matt Kopfhamer:Right. Because they they're they're technically rogue code at this At
Jagger May:this point. Because I'm Alfredo, you're right. It's Toy Story, but, like, incinerator?
Alfredo Brown:It's also kinda Wreck It Ralph. Sorry. I'm a keep of this. Alfredo doesn't
Jagger May:watch anything that isn't on
Alfredo Brown:Disney plus. Yeah. I I only watch animated Pixar things on Disney plus.
Jagger May:If it's not on Disney plus, he hasn't seen it, guys. Like, Black Mirror was huge for him.
Matt Kopfhamer:What I really I think one of the things I'm really excited to see is, yes, they're gonna explore the interior of the game, Infinity, but I also wanna see what's happening with the characters in real life. Like, Jimmy Simpson is the CEO now having to navigate that his CTO died because we know Robert Daly is no longer alive with the synopsis. Maybe. Maybe. Sure.
Matt Kopfhamer:Maybe they're bait and switching it. But if he truly is dead, now you have the genius behind the entire game is no longer there. So this company may be in flux. We may see some sort of crisis on that level that could then be the cause of the incinerator, if you will, JAG, where it's like, we have to close this game because we've lost a hundred thousands or however many subscribers and we're losing money. We're gonna close the company down.
Matt Kopfhamer:So that could be a a ticking time clock that we see in the episode where it's like, are the digital versions gonna be able to to cry for help to Nanette Cole and get her to listen again? Because that's that was a main plotline in the the first episodes. They were able to blackmail her to get her to take the DNA from Robert and set up the the ending. So will we see that kind of play against the inside and outside to create some sort of artificial time clock and incinerator, like you said? Or we're gonna see them explore this DNA assimilation technology that Robert seemingly, like, made himself?
Matt Kopfhamer:Maybe. Because that could be very interesting. Game.
Alfredo Brown:How how will they find out about that?
Matt Kopfhamer:Yeah. Go to his apartment and then see his setup. And then
Vignesh Doraiswamy:He's dead.
Matt Kopfhamer:When they find his body, it's right there next to his computer.
Alfredo Brown:All of
Matt Kopfhamer:these one person are like, what the fuck is this thing? And then, holy shit, we have a whole new revenue stream because we can digitize your consciousness and put it into the game. And now you can play against yourself for real.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:See, Kyle And that's how they think they take this. I agree. Like, I think that's how they take this. Charlie Parker talks about how this is gonna be, like, difficulty in, like, managing two different timelines. But I think that's what is this is gonna be.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Nanette Cole or Kristen Milioti's character, her outside character doesn't really know what happened. She's sort of oblivious. She knows that she was a part of something and she, but she doesn't really know. And if these guys lose their monetary stream, this is gonna be the way they monetize the game. This is what Walton's gonna have to do is they have to figure something else out.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:So we're gonna see two parallel stories. I think they're gonna sort of, you know, they'll converge at some point, but I think they'll also sort of mirror each other, not just to play off a black mirror a little bit, but I think we're gonna see very similar things happening to both versions, both inside and out, but they have to do this. I mean, there's another, like, seventy eight minute runtime. Right? I think that's what they're gonna do.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:And I agree. I'm we're fairly certain the guy's dead. Right? They talked about, like, yay. Good job.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:It's Christmas time. No one has to go home for, like, two weeks. And he has, like, the, you know, the do not disturb thing going on. Doesn't he have, a fridge full of or freezer full of people's DNA labeled? They're gonna know what he's doing.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Anymore.
Matt Kopfhamer:Well, I
Vignesh Doraiswamy:mean, that's question. Got rid of that. That's That's true. Yeah. Her she took it.
Jagger May:That's true. And
Vignesh Doraiswamy:That's true.
Matt Kopfhamer:Her
Jagger May:ID. I I wanna talk I wanna piggyback a little bit off what you said because, like, your guys' theory, to be honest, I don't think they should be worried monetarily at all because they're at that the business level where the CTO made it. Everyone else is clearly driving the ship at this point and coming up with patches and stuff. So, like but I'm saying that yours is more likely. I'm gonna get tinfoil hat and crazy.
Jagger May:The entire the second this is actually the second time I only watched it last night again. And the whole time I'm thinking, she's upset for nudes? Like, if you're hot, just let my nudes leak. You know? They only went so deep into those photos.
Jagger May:Like, I'm I'm not gonna lie.
Alfredo Brown:Here we go.
Jagger May:I'm not gonna lie. If I
Alfredo Brown:Alright. We'll be back after a commercial break.
Jagger May:Oh, come on, Alfredo. Like, I'm just saying, here's my theory. Is there something worse that's on there? And and she and that's gonna come into play. Because, like, again, for me, I wear a pod I wear a shirt on this pod because you guys asked me kindly to.
Jagger May:So like, I'm just saying, like,
Alfredo Brown:I don't I mean, covering nipples is like the bare minimum that we ask.
Jagger May:I get
Matt Kopfhamer:it. Jack, do you think this could be a hang the DJ type situation where it's like, we find out she's doing some real fuck shit in the background
Jagger May:and that's
Matt Kopfhamer:what she's really worried about?
Jagger May:Yes. Because, like, that's what I'm saying. Like, really think about you are willing to break into a CTO's house, do this weird thing, and steal DNA because of nudes. It it just doesn't translate. Like, I I I don't know.
Matt Kopfhamer:Yeah. I'm not scaling a building if like, just let my dick fly. Fuck
Jagger May:it. That's not what I'm saying. I'm like, I ain't doing all that, dog. Like, I'm sorry.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. I think you may have just found a weak point in the story, but I don't know if there's necessarily more. I think for each person, like, they they value it differently. Right? Like, we're four guys here talking about how a female should feel about nudes being leaked.
Alfredo Brown:I mean, there there's been so many instances where this happens. And, I mean, we've seen people commit suicide over less. I mean, it's kind of hard for us to say, like, where a character how a character should feel or what they should be doing. I think that just ended up being, like, a weak point. I don't know that I subscribe to the theory that there's some more darker or nefarious stuff that this character has been doing in the past.
Alfredo Brown:But I do agree with you
Matt Kopfhamer:that There could be.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I I do agree with you, though, that I don't think that the company Callister needs to be all that worried about their revenue streams. Like, they're gonna be good. They're essentially space Fortnite.
Alfredo Brown:Like, they they've got everything going on here. Yeah.
Matt Kopfhamer:But there could yes. Absolutely. That's definitely unlikely that they're gonna hit that, but it could be a plot point that they explore. I'm just saying. Trying to be predictable.
Alfredo Brown:I think the the the biggest plot point right now, at least for us as viewers, is are these characters going to survive? Do they and if they if they survive, what does that mean? It feels very similar to severance where we're asking what is survival for these characters because they kinda can't survive unless there's a a game. I mean, the only thing I could see in, like, the truest of Black Mirror fashion is that the Audi's, so to speak, they actually die, and their consciousness just lives inside the video game characters, and that's it. That would be the most Black Mirror thing ever is that the people on the outside no longer exist, and they are trapped in the game forever, forever, for real.
Alfredo Brown:And that's where they live and die.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:And this is because
Jagger May:Calaster is just like a let's talk about the revenue because, Koff, you kinda said this. Yeah. This could just be a San Junipero prequel. They're just like, hey. You know?
Jagger May:Like, why don't we, you know like, if we get the government to subsidize this? Or or better yet, US health care, they'll pay us a hell of a lot of money, and we can really jack up these prices. That's that's more of the plot. Like, my my plot's fun. My, like, she's doing weird shit, and it's not just nudes thing.
Jagger May:It's fun. But that may that seems a little bit more black mirror and realistic, and I will accept the shame that you've cast upon me, Alfredo. No. For my opinion.
Alfredo Brown:I just I just know that you you and I, we watch things very differently. I know that, like, a %. You're referencing the darkest episodes of Black Mirror, I'm like, guys, it's Toy Story. Like, I understand. We are definitely on two opposite sides of the coin.
Jagger May:Guy that's only seen Boss Baby. Yeah. This is giving me real Boss Baby vibes.
Alfredo Brown:I've never seen Boss Baby. I was gonna say that.
Matt Kopfhamer:Perfectly because it's Dreamworks and not Disney. Yeah.
Jagger May:Yeah. That's what's One thing it's
Alfredo Brown:Fuck you. DreamWorks is great. How to Train Your Dragon. And Shrek. Shrek.
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. And Shrek. Yeah. Not the new one.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:You know, I casually dropped in, like, how about Tron in there maybe? But one thing we haven't talked about is the potential for the escape of these digital clones. Is there a way that they can escape into the real world is also a very black mirror esque thing that we haven't quite seen yet. We often see the opposite. Right?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:We see them use the same technology or at least it looks like the same technology as San Junipero. And theoretically, like, maybe this DNA assimilation uses some of that cookie and grain stuff that we see in, like, White Christmas and hang the and the entire history of you. Because you gotta wonder, how do you create someone's entire memory with just their DNA unless you have sort of the grain typing that you get in the entire history of you. And I don't know. San Junipero I mean, not San Junipero.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:This episode, USS Callister for all of its incredible stuff, they mailed it in a little bit on the technology. Maybe it was a time constraint thing, but there was enough established technology in the universe that they could have used to explain away everything that they they did in this episode. And that's not a huge criticism for me. I actually really enjoyed this episode. But, what if they do it the other way around?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Do we see a way that in this Black Mirror universe, they allow these digital clones to make it back out into the real world as their only means of escape? Because that could be a really fun point. Because yeah.
Jagger May:Go ahead.
Matt Kopfhamer:Have you seen cloning in any of the episodes yet? Like, actual cloning? I don't remember.
Jagger May:No. But season five, episode three, Rachel, Jack, and Ashley too, Miley Cyrus, her pop stars put into a doll. Like, it be like, it's a a sentient little Furby, essentially.
Matt Kopfhamer:Or you
Jagger May:So, like, that's an option as well. Another thing too, and this is me getting into into them trenches and understanding how hardware and software work. Technically, Robert Daly's mind is on that computer somewhere. Is trapped, and it is recoverable. And, like, this we've we've referenced every sci fi thing ever, and I'm gonna put a dollar in the anime jar, ghost in the shell.
Jagger May:We have a psychopathic computer that breaks through. And what if he is starts attacking other gamers because he breaks through? Like, what what if he becomes like this big bad that we don't know about?
Alfredo Brown:Somehow Robert Daly returned. Got it.
Jagger May:Somehow, that data lives somewhere, Alfred.
Alfredo Brown:No. It was it was not only that.
Matt Kopfhamer:But not only that, but that digital version of him has now been trapped for god knows how long inside this bubble dimension that was basically nothing but blackness. So he could be absolutely off his fucking rocker when he finally saw the
Jagger May:on it when he was alive. Yeah.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:He was never on the rocker.
Alfredo Brown:That's And super vindictive. Was the biggest question that you just posed, Koff, is even if the outside version of Robert Daley died, is the digital version actually still dead? Is there a separation of consciousness? Because we have seen that with the other characters. So did he do the same thing with himself where there is a DNA version a DNA that he's put of himself and took yeah.
Alfredo Brown:I oof.
Matt Kopfhamer:And imagine
Alfredo Brown:He hasn't been confirmed, by the way.
Matt Kopfhamer:Yeah. So imagine somebody like Walton, right, going and being like, okay. Well, this is all company property, taking that computer, plugging it into the Callister mainframe, and boom. Ghost in the Shell Robert Robert Daly is now inside everything controlling it from nefariously within. So yeah.
Matt Kopfhamer:Yeah. I take this. I would love to
Alfredo Brown:see that.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:He he already kinda gives me some Matt Damon vibes. So this would be like some perfect Matt Damon interstellar uncredited unexplained well, not uncredited, but, like, unexplained and just pops up. It would be it would be pretty good. I like it.
Alfredo Brown:I will say this. Nope. Nope. We're not doing that one. There goes our chance of ever having Jesse Plemons on the show.
Alfredo Brown:Thanks, Yeah. I will say this. The show creator, Charlie Brooker, he compares this upcoming episode to solving two Rubik's cubes at once with consequences in both timelines. Says if the first one was Star Trek, then this one is more like Star Wars, faster pace, more chaos, and real world stakes. So we're gonna get a lot of the the stepping into the both worlds and and seeing all that.
Alfredo Brown:I'm curious as to how much does this stay under wraps. Do the actual players start to see something going on in there? Because last time these characters in the game tried to reach out to, Nanette in real life, what if they're able to reach out to other characters? Is like, how how could that even unfold?
Jagger May:I mean, it has to happen at some point on there. Like and and and we gotta go into, like, the other real human aspects of this. There's four guys and two girls. Do they start trying to interact with other gamers somehow in there? Can you even do that?
Jagger May:And I'm not just trying to go that way because I'm a dude. But realistically, you're still a human being up here with desires. And this is, like, to bring up the point that you have other stuff out there. I don't think really, my only question is, what's the time difference between this and this, this episode and the sequel?
Matt Kopfhamer:Striking Vipers. I mean, why not both? Yes. Well, yeah.
Jagger May:It's
Alfredo Brown:true. It's all it's all the same world. Yeah.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I mean, to, like, complete the Two different references. Complete our, like, sci fi references and anime references too. I mean, this is, like, again, explored everywhere. But I really wanna go back to what Koff and Jagger were talking about. I think it would be a really, really interesting take.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I don't think they do it. I wish they would. Where Robert Daly kinda goes, like, all agent Smith in the matrix on these people that he is unleashed back in, and he has he has all these powers. Right? We see what he can do.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:He's sorta like Wanda in WandaVision. Right? Within he has mastery over the code. He can do whatever. But then going back to what y'all were talking about, in terms of, like, do they interact with other players in the game?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I think I'm with Jagger. I think they have to. I think that will be the most interesting thing that they can do. And I think that would be, like, a really great way to build the story further and maybe just maybe have, like, make this a trilogy. I think there's more coming.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I think there's not enough to answer all the questions. I really do think this this continues and that there is a Callister three.
Alfredo Brown:Well, one of the things that they mentioned in the promo for this or the teaser is you hear the net Cole saying, oh, so it's us versus millions of other gamers that are online. Like, there there is going to be that interaction. The stakes are gonna be real where if they die in the game, they're they're they're dead. I wonder how much that connects to their real life. I don't know how it would, but I'm sure there's something there.
Alfredo Brown:If we're gonna have stakes on the outside, there's gotta be something that connects to these characters in the real world. I'm I'm curious as to how they might do that.
Matt Kopfhamer:I think the the crew of the Callister just could become griefers and just start taking out other players.
Jagger May:Yeah. I was about yeah. I was about to say it'll be like that, or maybe they reach out to get some type of buffers or something. It's like, look. You know, I'll hang out in here.
Jagger May:This is dope. You know, whatever. But, like, I don't want so and so who's had a bad day and blowing off steam by killing NPCs to fuck up my life in here. Like, to me, that's, like, the bare minimum that they're gonna need. Because it's like you said, man.
Jagger May:We've all video games give us this outlet to be a little crazy. That's the theme of Westworld that, like, just terrible. We have all played Grand Theft Auto and just done heinous things.
Matt Kopfhamer:Heinous. Just
Jagger May:because yeah. Like like, you're just like, I I need a shower after that session because what I just did would be just horrific. You know? Like, you you because you had a bad day. I'm just gonna blow up an entire city of people because they're NPCs.
Alfredo Brown:Me and Big were off playing Yoshi's Story and Jags Funnel.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Yeah, man. I've I've actually never played I was gonna say, never played any of the GTA games, so I cannot relate to Right. Were line.
Matt Kopfhamer:Never played them. You've
Vignesh Doraiswamy:never had a console, man. PC gamer.
Jagger May:And it was just You've never had a console?
Vignesh Doraiswamy:What the Nintendo Switch.
Alfredo Brown:This is a bigger conversation. Holy pod. Gotta Starting right now.
Jagger May:This. Guys, comment if you want a whole episode of of why Vegas never played a video game. It's a big deal. We gotta shove past this Alfredo. You
Vignesh Doraiswamy:know, so Charlie Brooker was a video game journalist. I think that is something to think about as we as we think about what he is trying to do here. But video gamers, like, you can't become griefers. They cannot go off killing NPCs because they don't want attention. The moment these NPCs start getting attention is when they are at big, big risk of, like, permanent, you know, for someone being raised.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Not a
Alfredo Brown:big gamer. What is griefer? I keep hearing you guys saying, I have no idea. I can't keep pretending like I know what it means.
Matt Kopfhamer:Somebody who goes around and fucks other people's shit up for fun.
Jagger May:Yeah. Like, you're not in there. You're a troll.
Alfredo Brown:Troll.
Jagger May:That's what it is. You're you're a video game troll. Yeah. You're not in it. And so
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I don't think they do that because
Jagger May:for the the fuck yous.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Because for every video game, you will find, like, these people who do nothing but the video game. Right? The people who are there to crack the meta. And for people who are trying to crack that meta, so to speak, to figure out what is the best way to be the best at this video game, they will recognize that there's a group of characters or players that are not playing the game right. It's like you see it all over the place.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Like, if you ever watched a report. Yeah. Moderately moderately boring, but sometimes entertaining anime called sword art online. There are some characters there that, like, get to do I know. That's why.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:That's why I said entertaining, but kinda meh. But they those like, they're all in a video game. It's the same idea. They're all trapped. But some characters just do things that shouldn't be plausible within the confines of the video game, and they become targets.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:So I don't think these guys they're all they're gamers too. Right? They're coders. I don't think they want to really get all that attention on themselves. It'll be really interesting to see how they navigate this, but becoming a griefer is a one way shot to getting the entire millions to take you out, and they need to avoid that at all costs.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:So I think they do the opposite. I think they try to, like, somehow stay under the radar for as long as possible.
Matt Kopfhamer:I think it may be unintentional. I think they may interact with somebody, do something by accident that makes them labeled as, like, griefers in the game, and now you have the entire player base, like, get them. So I could see that
Alfredo Brown:being These aren't gamers.
Matt Kopfhamer:Mm-mm.
Alfredo Brown:Like, these main characters are not gamers. They work for a gaming company, but they don't seem to be gamers at all. They just seem to be
Matt Kopfhamer:Yeah. It's not a mean gamer. Seems like a gamer. And that's Yeah.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:She, like, appreciates Robert Daly's code. And
Alfredo Brown:Yeah. She was, yeah, she was very inspired by Robert Daly, but a lot of the other characters, not not so much at all.
Jagger May:Jillian from Martin
Matt Kopfhamer:Simpson, for sure.
Jagger May:Yeah. Fucking Jillian, man.
Alfredo Brown:Poor Jillian. Got turned into a monster. Yep. Well, boys, any predictions that you guys have for this episode? Anything that you haven't gotten off your chest yet about this upcoming episode?
Alfredo Brown:I'm really excited for it.
Matt Kopfhamer:I've covered all my predictions. Yeah.
Jagger May:Was about to say, man. Spit them all out. I like, anything
Vignesh Doraiswamy:Here's my prediction. Really making it up. We didn't get it right. I don't think any of this is what we're gonna see. I think they're gonna catch something that we did not think of.
Jagger May:It's gonna be even sadder, even darker, or maybe even happier.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:No. That's what I think. Agree, Jack. That's what I think actually. My prediction is people are seeing this as, like, a bright ending and as not a very Black Mirror esque episode in USS Callister.
Vignesh Doraiswamy:I think this episode brings us back to the roots of Black Mirror, and it's gonna be really depressing. I don't think you get a, quote, unquote, happy ending. I think you see what actually is happening, and it's gonna be real sad. That's my prediction.
Alfredo Brown:Damn. Big drop of knowledge on us. Well, boys, I think it's gonna be a wrap on this one. I'm excited. We're gonna be covering, at least three of the top Black Mirror episodes.
Alfredo Brown:Obviously, Into Infinity is going to be one of them. And we're gonna get two other episodes. You know what? We'd love it for all of you that are watching or listening in a review or in the comments below. Let us know which episodes you want us to do.
Alfredo Brown:We're definitely gonna be checking out those as they release on Netflix, Black Mirror season seven. We're also we just finished up White Lotus season three. We're watching Daredevil. We've got Last of Us coming up on HBO. So there's a ton of reasons for you to subscribe to the Unbench podcast here on YouTube or on Apple or Spotify wherever you get your podcasts.
Alfredo Brown:And as always, I wanna thank you guys for watching or listening all the way through for myself, for Jagger, for Vig, for Koff. We'll see you next time.
